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Patrick Donnelly
08-15-2007, 10:26 AM
I'm looking for some help on transitioning to IF, and this seems to be the best place to go.

This past Friday, Saturday, and Sunday, I was on a trip, and messed up my diet pretty badly (lots of good foods, but in bad proportions, and far too much grain), so I figure now is a good time to fix it up completely. I've tried to cut back the carb intake these past three days, because from what I gather, ~100g is all you need and too much more can prevent ketosis.

Right now, I'm eating:
- 50 blocks fat (almonds, Brazil nuts, some natural peanut butter, etc.)
- 25 blocks protein (chicken, tuna, beef, salmon, eggs, cottage cheese ~4 times a week, etc.)
- 15 blocks carbs (mostly fruit, some vegetables, no grain, etc.)

I'm 6'1, 178#, and decently lean already.

I've been doing poorly with this reduced carb intake though. I feel a lot more sore, sleepy, and unable to push as hard during workouts. Will this fade in the next few days? And should I switch to IF after I get acclimated to lower carbs, or should I just do it now?

I know I should get my carbohydrates from more vegetables than I do, and maybe that would help... Do you have any suggestions? I'm really not capable of cooking and eating the required volume, and most of the vegetables around the house are high-GI anyway (frozen peas, corn, cooked carrots, etc.).


Thanks for any help you can give.

Robb Wolf
08-15-2007, 03:57 PM
Patrick-
don;t worry too much about getting the carbs from veggies, especially if you are tinkering with intermittent fasting. Fruit, yams etc are great, especially post WO.

Implementation-
Start slow! 12-13 hrs at first, see how you feel...extend it over time (a few weeks) working up to 16 hrs some days. If you feel good and have good performance/body comp keep at it. If not...back off and find a good spot to stay around.

No hard rules, just tinkering!

Patrick Donnelly
08-15-2007, 04:15 PM
Alright. I'll start tomorrow with a wide feeding window.

During the school year, I hope to have it down to a few hours in the evening. This will allow me to conveniently eat while doing my homework (as opposed to taking frequent breaks), and prevent me from having to wake up early to eat breakfast/make lunch. Haha! http://img362.imageshack.us/img362/1091/iconwackobz7.gif



Any tips on how to explain this to my parents, if they ask?

Stuart Mather
08-15-2007, 04:28 PM
Patrick, I think it's so important to make the IF transition really gradual, much more important than gradual carb reduction. I spent several months getting to even 15 hrs. Nine months later, most days I do 18, and about every third day I'll extend it between 2 and 5 hrs. No hunger issues, great body comp and energy. Low carb/If rocks. But you have to be patient.

Stuart

Robb Wolf
08-16-2007, 07:37 AM
Explain and describe things as little as possible...it will just scare people!

Patrick Donnelly
08-16-2007, 12:24 PM
Well, I was feeling no hunger today when I broke my 14 hour fast at noon. I think I'll try for 15 hours tomorrow (9PM today -> noon tomorrow), and stay there for a while.

I don't know how my performance is doing, because today is a rest day, and I still have yet to do my "active rest" and stretching.


Re: Robb
Sounds like a plan.

Brad Hirakawa
08-16-2007, 05:36 PM
Yeah.... gradual is good.

I did it the wrong/hard way. Jumped right into low carb and IF to the tune of 20 hours sessions a few times per week. Pain.. lots of pain. Almost lost my job and sanity due to mood swings (carb withdrawal?). Called Robb promptly thereafter and explained that this IF business was for psychos and commies. He advised to back off a bit, moderation. Ugh.. I dislike that word, moderation, though it is a good one.

All better now. I'm still an a-hole most of the time, but most of the time is better than all of the time.

On a serious note, my blood pressure medication dose has been halved since starting the lower carb / paleo approach.

Very nice.

Brad

Mike ODonnell
08-16-2007, 07:19 PM
Also on the taking it easy thing, ease into your first meal after any long fast. I reminded myself the hard way the other day. Going to a hibachi buffett and pounding down the meat....stomach not happy. I now ease in with some raw fruit or vegetables, get the enzymes going then add in 30-60 min with a larger meal.

Eric Jones
08-16-2007, 08:13 PM
+1 for that

I had a gorge yesterday after a 16hour fast after my workout. Digestive tract not happy.

Robb Wolf
08-17-2007, 06:24 AM
I think the only way a serious food freak-out is going to go ok is when you have access to a bed and a binky...nap time!

Brad Hirakawa
08-17-2007, 08:41 AM
Great blog by the way Robb, good reading there!

Patrick Donnelly
08-17-2007, 02:54 PM
Well, I'm feeling perfectly fine during the fast, though I'm not sure what to say about performance. I did a Half-Murph today, and it took me about 38 minutes. That time is pretty bad, though I think that's more due to lack of conditioning rather than diet. I started doing MetCon again less than three weeks ago, after taking a while off to do strength training.

Jane Michel
08-18-2007, 07:25 AM
Great blog by the way Robb, good reading there!

sorry, a wee bit off-topic below:

1. arghgh robb how come there was no huge annoucement about your blog?! i like it a lot!

2. this pic is the best: http://photos1.blogger.com/x/blogger/6048/3770/1600/460362/robb_trough.jpg (WFS)

Patrick Donnelly
08-18-2007, 04:39 PM
On the blog:
I would never, ever, get into water that cold...
I would think that could even throw you into shock if you had just finished a tough MetCon.

On IF:
- My performance does not seem to be suffering. Today, I did ME deadlifts, 1-1-1-1-1, with only 2.5 minutes rest; I was very short on time. On rep 4, I tried 280# (old PR), and nearly got it. I'm really surprised I got that close with such little rest between the lifts. After the failure, rep 5 came no where close. Oh well.
- Today, my fasting window got extended to 16.5 hours, due to scheduling I couldn't control... And I didn't really mind. This transition is going easy.
- I noticed that I tend to drink less water during the fasting period than I should. This needs fixing.
- I'm sore after yesterday, but not as sore as I thought I'd be.
- Last night, I got 11 hours of sleep. This is unusual, and I'll need to keep track of further nights.

Jane Michel
08-20-2007, 05:09 AM
how's the fasting going patrick?

what happened to eric and mike has also happened to me. ugh!

Robb Wolf
08-20-2007, 07:57 AM
HA!! Yep, that was some COLD water...almost an inch of ice on top that I had to break through to get in. The real buggar is you get to either do the cold dip or stretch...if you stretch you will be too cold to jump in...at least that's my problem. REALLY tough to nut up for that!

The blog is cooking along...I am starting another blog to cover health/fitness topics more thoroughly and then the norcal blog will mainly relate to gym topics and content...will post that when it's cooking. Loads of intermittent fasting info on that new blog...using that to flesh out some of the book content!

Eric Jones
08-20-2007, 06:58 PM
I can't wait for the new blog!

Patrick Donnelly
08-20-2007, 08:03 PM
how's the fasting going patrick?
Absolutely lovely. I have no idea why I didn't start before.


Re: Robb
Do you have a corresponding hot bath that you swap off with that one, or do you only do the cold?

Troy Archie
08-20-2007, 08:14 PM
ease into your first meal after any long fast. I reminded myself the hard way the other day. Going to a hibachi buffett and pounding down the meat....stomach not happy.

I did a plus 36 hour fast a couple weeks back and it played games with my digestive system for like a week.

Robb Wolf
08-21-2007, 07:36 AM
Absolutely lovely. I have no idea why I didn't start before.


Re: Robb
Do you have a corresponding hot bath that you swap off with that one, or do you only do the cold?

I wish we had that set up but for now it's just the cold dip. We are looking at a larger/jiggier facility and we will definitely offer some top end hydrotherapy to enhance recovery.

Scott Kustes
08-21-2007, 09:03 AM
I wish we had that set up but for now it's just the cold dip. We are looking at a larger/jiggier facility and we will definitely offer some top end hydrotherapy to enhance recovery.
How about massages? Asian-style?

Patrick Donnelly
08-21-2007, 11:13 AM
If that's cold, I would hate to use your idea of a "hot bath," Robb.

Brad Hirakawa
08-21-2007, 09:42 PM
.. probably involves olive oil. Much like Chuck Norris, the boiling point of water is just too darn low for Robb.

:)

Patrick Donnelly
08-22-2007, 07:08 PM
Dammit.

Explain and describe things as little as possible...it will just scare people!

So does not explaining, apparently. It's funny how my mom yells at me about how I eat, asking me if I think I'm "better than everyone else" because I eat healthy, "weird," "abnormally," "obsessively," etc. while my 265# dad is sitting right beside me just reading the newspaper...

Luckily, my dad is more understanding (though he's opposed to trying anything as 'radical' as The Zone).

Anyone have any really solid studies I could show him to try to explain this? Preferably, not from any sites that will obviously be biased in it's favor.

Scott Kustes
08-23-2007, 05:52 AM
Lose weight and be healthy. That'll show them.

Brian Shanks
08-23-2007, 10:20 AM
I have found that my biggest critics are those that are afraid to change so they see the changes in me, see that it is possible to change, and realize their own failure to do so.

Bri

Scott Clark
08-26-2007, 11:11 AM
How about massages? Asian-style?

x2

Patrick, I started IF about a month ago and began with a 16 hour fast. I had no trouble at all, but that's likely just how I react to it and from what I hear most people do better with a 12 hour fast then building up. When I IF it's from 8pm - 12 noon, that's probably why I found it so easy, because I am merely skipping breakfast and a snack. I think I would have significant trouble fasting in the afternoon.