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Suzanne Buffie
09-17-2007, 05:23 AM
Hello,
This is my first post, have been reading for awhile...

When IF'ing, how much should I eat within my window for maximal fat loss?

Should I be trying to eat a certain amount of protein within my eating window?

I ask because Fast 5 seems to contradict some of what I have read around here with regards to how much food to eat during your eating window.

Thanks for your input...Suzanne

Allen Yeh
09-17-2007, 06:17 AM
Hello,
This is my first post, have been reading for awhile...

When IF'ing, how much should I eat within my window for maximal fat loss?

Should I be trying to eat a certain amount of protein within my eating window?

I ask because Fast 5 seems to contradict some of what I have read around here with regards to how much food to eat during your eating window.

Thanks for your input...Suzanne

It really depends on the "flavor" of IF you are doing, I haven't done the Fast 5 so I can't comment on it other than what I read. The Fast 5 approach seems to be eat whatever during that time, right?

The approach I feel that is more followed here is to still eat the macro's you need but in a shorter eating period. After a while you may find that you don't need as many macro's as before but people still keep count typically.

I still follow the 1 gram protein /1pound LBM rule when IF'ing.

Garrett Smith
09-17-2007, 10:58 AM
I'm doing around 2/3 g per lb BW (on weekdays, I do about a 6-7 hour feed window) and I'm maintaining just fine...been doing that for several weeks now.

In fact, I set PRs at this BW last night in the OHS, FS, and BS in my sixth workout of the week, so something must be working!!!

Mike ODonnell
09-17-2007, 12:30 PM
You could go with 0.6 (non active) to 0.8grams (more active) per lean lbs bodyweight....which is around the range of what Dr G said of 2/3 total for most people. If your goal is gaining muscle then it may have to be more 1.0g+. IF is a funny thing because as you improve digestive process then you can assimulate and use more efficiently the protein you intake....so hence you may only need 0.6grams/lean lbs to maintain for your active lifestyle. So it's not really how much you eat that counts, it's how much you assimulate. Adding things like digestive enzymens can also improve that.

As for the fast five approach, I'm pretty sure that is meant for general weight loss with little to no strength training. The more you train, the more protein you will need to maintain and keep muscle. As I believe that the goal around here is keeping muscle while losing fat for maximum performance.

Stuart Mather
09-17-2007, 03:59 PM
IF is a funny thing because as you improve digestive process then you can assimulate and use more efficiently the protein you intake....so hence you may only need 0.6grams/lean lbs to maintain for your active lifestyle. So it's not really how much you eat that counts, it's how much you assimulate. Adding things like digestive enzymens can also improve that.



That's what I'm also finding. It's almost disconcerting. I'm alternating between a 18 hr fast one day and 19 or 20 the next. I'm in the 9th month of IF and for about the first 7 months I really had to ensure I was getting at least .8g/ lb lean lbs to slowly gain muscle. But for the last couple of weeks I'm finding that even .5g is plenty. I'm also finding that I'm eating far less fat (carbs have been < 50g for five years now, way before I added IF). I still enjoy food and eating. I'm just not nearly as hungry during my eating window, and the amount of fat/protein which completely satisfies my appetite is also plenty for the moderately muscled body comp I'm really happy with.

It's kind of annoying that the really breathtaking improvements in digestive efficiency have taken so long for IF to produce for me (YMMV :) ). I just wish I'd discovered lowcarb IF years earlier.

It's probably worth mentioning that I don't do conventional workouts. Every day I do about 4 really intense 3 minute body weight sessions wherever I happen to be, consisting of 35 unsupported hindu squats, 20 back bridges, 25 hindu pressups and 2 unsupported handstand push ups - all without a break and as fast as I can manage. The last one is always a couple of hours before I break my fast.

My take on the physiology of this kind of multiple 'intermittent' short workout is that muscle and liver glycogen never comes close to being exhausted even on very low carbs and there is plenty of time for FFA metabolism to replenish it before the next one. Even three minutes of resistance done like this is very hard work! Episodic short intense resistance exercise. Can you tell I'm an Art de Vany fan ? :) .

Stuart.

Steve Liberati
09-17-2007, 05:18 PM
Fast 5 is a half ass diet IMO. How can a diet possibly yield healthy,long-term positive results by only doing half the work? Why even go through the trouble of fasting for 15-20 hours only to sabotage the benefits you've obtained by eating crap food when the fast is over. Makes no sense. The bad simply cancels out the good. So before I go any further on my tangent (lol) my suggestion to you is to do the fast part of the Fast 5 Diet and eat according to the Paleo guidelines on Zone ratio's. Balance your meals to a nice 40c/30f/30p split...eat Paleo-friendl foods... and you''ll be sure to cover all bases. Try it for a month and adjust.

Scott Kustes
09-18-2007, 03:41 AM
I concur with Steve. Quality is more important than fasting. I'd rather see someone eat Paleo, 6 meals/day than fast for 20 hours and eat bread, pasta, and donuts. Course, I was always one of the weirdos that thought Paleo should come before Zone....quality before quantity.

Patrick Donnelly
09-18-2007, 11:28 AM
When you do intermittent fasting, how much protein can you intake at once?

I normally hear something like 35g per meal is the maximum, but is that really true? And for how long is that supposed to be? In a small feeding window, meals can easily be 1-1.5 hours apart.

Garrett Smith
09-18-2007, 12:57 PM
Patrick,
The amount of protein I can take in at once is wholly dependent upon how many veggies I'm consuming in the same meal.

The number you've heard is urban legend BS.

Restrict intake of nearly any nutrient (including protein) and the body becomes more efficient (hungrier) at processing & assimilating it. IFing makes for a "hungry" system that tears through food and absorbs it incredibly well.

The typical BBing force-feedings every 2-3 hours make for a body that is incredibly INefficient at processing and assimilating food. Thus a "limit" is put on how much to eat, because the body just doesn't use the food as well.

Remember that all the old "rules" of eating/nutrition change drastically once placed into an IF framework.

Suzanne Buffie
09-19-2007, 05:05 AM
Thanks, everyone, for your help.

Another question...Does heavy cream in coffee during the fasting window negate the benefits of IF? I have a very hard time drinking black coffee (rather not drink it) and a harder time giving it up all together...

Garrett Smith
09-19-2007, 05:38 AM
Suzanne,
I've recently read some Edgar Cayce stuff about coffee, and I wholly agree with his perspective on it.

Coffee by itself (black, no sugar) is a food and has its own benefits.

Coffee with cream forms a "leathery curd" (his words) and coats the stomach and damages the digestion.

Try light coconut milk in the coffee, see if that works for you. Store the extra in a jar in your fridge.

Mike ODonnell
09-19-2007, 06:39 AM
Thanks, everyone, for your help.

Another question...Does heavy cream in coffee during the fasting window negate the benefits of IF? I have a very hard time drinking black coffee (rather not drink it) and a harder time giving it up all together...

I use some half and half with my morning americano.....hard to say 100% that all the hormonal benefits from fasting are not affected but it's so small I doubt it has any insulin response. Never done any blood work to back that up though. In the end....works for me.

I like Dr G's recommendation of Coconut Milk.....I guess that would be a better option if you were having coffee at home.