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sarena kopciel
12-24-2007, 07:04 PM
Ok so now that I eat meat for over a year now, I once again, for many months now, love chicken livers. These I can get Kosher organic. Kosher is a religious requirement for me. The brand says they start them on grass but finish them on grain. I know this isnt the best, but, that's what is available to me.

Now I am wondering and starting to be interested in other organ meats since reading how tasty they are from Scotty, Jay, now Kim and Susie and others. But these I cannot get in any way shape or form organic and Kosher. I can probably get Kosher beef tongue but it definitely would be from traditional cows. I am concerned that the organs would have an accumulation of the hormones. How right am I?

Should I just forget the thought of other organ meats or is it OK to buy these if loaded (possiblly) with meds/hormones?

Ale Dileo
12-25-2007, 12:14 AM
when i cannot provide grassfed animals I go for the younger ones, like lamb or calf liver.

Bo Bolund
12-25-2007, 02:09 AM
Ok so now that I eat meat for over a year now, I once again, for many months now, love chicken livers. These I can get Kosher organic. Kosher is a religious requirement for me. The brand says they start them on grass but finish them on grain. I know this isnt the best, but, that's what is available to me.

Now I am wondering and starting to be interested in other organ meats since reading how tasty they are from Scotty, Jay, now Kim and Susie and others. But these I cannot get in any way shape or form organic and Kosher. I can probably get Kosher beef tongue but it definitely would be from traditional cows. I am concerned that the organs would have an accumulation of the hormones. How right am I?

Should I just forget the thought of other organ meats or is it OK to buy these if loaded (possiblly) with meds/hormones?

What do you do with your chicken liver?
Any recipes?

sarena kopciel
12-25-2007, 05:58 AM
What do you do with your chicken liver?
Any recipes?

Generally I just saute a lot of onions and garlic with olive oil and toss in liver for a bit. Then I add some salt and pepper. I tried adding in Za'taar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Za'atar), (wfs)a middle eastern spice mix last week and it was great! I also added in the other day a box of fresh baby spinach (chopped roughly first). No one in my family was the wiser, which worked perfectly!!

Frank Needham
12-25-2007, 07:05 AM
This is related but not exactly in the same vein as kosher organ meats. In my immediate area there are lots of Latino markets (Vegas in about 30-40% Hispanic). I like a lot of the meats they use so we sometimes visit when the need arises. They sell lots of offal. Primarily things like beef liver, tongue, tripe, and various other cuts from the carcass that caucasian folk don't usually eat. Chicken and pork parts too. But, the prices are very reasonable on this stuff. I bought smoked pork there yesterday for $2.29/lb ?! Try that at your favorite butcher. Bought beef liver also for $1.29/lb. Didn't care for it though but that is probably due to how I attempted to cook it more than anything else. I'm not too sure of the hormone level in these products might be but would be interested to know. If anyone has any input, anecdotal or otherwise, I'd be interested to hear it.

Susie Rosenberg
12-25-2007, 05:25 PM
I wouldn't recommend eating the liver of any animal that isn't organic and grassfed.

Cows raised on feedlots have fatty livers from the abnormal way they are fed, and fatty livers are diseased livers. The fat-infiltrated stage is what preceeds cirrhosis and end-stage liver failure.

Plus, any animal routinely fed antibiolics and non-organic feed will have drug and pesticide residues in their livers--which processes those chemicals--and in their body fat, where those compounds are sequestered and stored.

Tongue is different. It doesn't get fatty deposits like the liver nor does it play a metabolic role in clearing drugs and pesticides from the body, so I can say it's at least no worse for you than the skeletal muscle of the cow, and may even be a notch better.

But I really think eating commercially raised beef or chicken liver is not a good choice.

Susie

Frank Needham
12-26-2007, 05:57 AM
Being curious I googled "eating beef liver" and found this from Weston A Price: http://www.westonaprice.org/foodfeatures/liver.html
Seems to be some pretty solid info on what type of liver to eat and several suggestions on how to prepare it.

Garrett Smith
12-26-2007, 05:59 AM
Sarena,
I definitely agree with Susie on the liver, get it grassfed or organic (both if you're really lucky!) or don't bother.

As for tongue, it's a very low-fat cut, so it would be a good choice if one was going to be eating grain-fed non-organic. That being said, the tongue doesn't really fall under "organ meat", as it is a muscle. I have never heard of any differences nutritionally (advantage-wise) of tongue over muscle meat, so I'd say go with grass-fed muscle meat over grain-fed tongue. If you want some variety, go for it every once in a while!

That's a great article on liver, Frank. For those who don't read it, the main thing is that the liver is a processing organ, it's not a storage place, or else our livers would keep growing with accumulated toxins our whole lives. However, in a grain-fed hormone+antibiotic -fed cow, the liver is likely fatty and sick, which means it would be accumulating toxins--possibly at a higher rate than normal fatty tissue due to the general affinity of the liver for toxins so it can process them.

Wish you had more luck with the kosher availability.

Jay Cohen
12-26-2007, 07:58 AM
Frank;
Many thanks for the great link.
Now I see how I can make a Liver shake, along with other great recipes.

Kelly Moore
12-26-2007, 11:32 AM
A word of caution if you try the "raw liver pill" idea in the Weston Price article: make sure the frozen liver "pills" are a little thawed before swallowing them. I nearly choked to death one night after trying to swallow several of the frozen treats. The square beasties froze together forming a ball in my throat while swallowing and I came close to expiring in my apartment.

I managed not to panic but being strangled by frozen pieces of liver from the inside out isn't fun. The "pills" managed to soften up just enough that I was able to force them down, but I experienced narrowing tunnel vision plus a sore gut from unsuccessful self Heimlich. I hate to imagine what the cops/EMTs would have thought if they had found my body with hunks of raw liver lining my throat....:eek:

After that experience I cut the frozen liver into pills and allowed them thaw during my workout. A little on the chewy and slick side, but no longer life threatening.

Garrett Smith
12-26-2007, 12:12 PM
Nice tip, Kelly. Good to know!

I had a buddy who would dice up raw liver into small pieces, probably very much like pill-size, and eat one with each solid bite of salad he took. He said he couldn't even really taste it.

Man, I need to get a big freezer, for two reasons:
1) The local grassfed beef lady only sells 1/4 cows at a time,
2) My wife really doesn't want offal in the "regular" freezer with her berries.

Off to Craigslist!

Frank Needham
12-26-2007, 12:22 PM
Nice tip, Kelly. Good to know!

I had a buddy who would dice up raw liver into small pieces, probably very much like pill-size, and eat one with each solid bite of salad he took. He said he couldn't even really taste it.

Man, I need to get a big freezer, for two reasons:
1) The local grassfed beef lady only sells 1/4 cows at a time,
2) My wife really doesn't want offal in the "regular" freezer with her berries.

Off to Craigslist!

G, you'll be happy to know that used meat freezers are cheap and easy to come by. I found one in the local paper here for $75 that performs great. Used it for breastmilk storage but now am looking to stock it with grassfed stuff. Just north of here there are several ranches where one can buy hormone free, grassfed/grain finished stuff as well as free range chickens for pretty reasonable. I've just got to find time to get up there for a day.

Kelly, that little misadventure sounds ghastly to say the least.

Jay, let me know how the shake turns out. I think I'll be sticking to cooked calf's liver, thank you all the same.

Garrett Smith
12-26-2007, 12:31 PM
I will say, a liver shake done low-carb Paleo style might even be too much for me.

When I made them, I used plenty of frozen pineapple or other berries. Figured it was worth the carbs to get the liver in...

Yael Grauer
12-26-2007, 02:18 PM
1) The local grassfed beef lady only sells 1/4 cows at a time,

If you're talking Saguaro-Juniper grass-finished beef, I will split a 1/4 with you. We could each get an 8th!

Chris Forbis
12-26-2007, 07:20 PM
Man, I need to get a big freezer, for two reasons:
1) The local grassfed beef lady only sells 1/4 cows at a time,
2) My wife really doesn't want offal in the "regular" freezer with her berries.

Off to Craigslist!

This is one of the main reasons I don't like apartment living; there's not enough room for a big freezer...

chris hill
12-28-2007, 04:23 AM
liver and tongue are two of my favourite meats, always have been since a child, i never appreciated how good they were though

Garrett Smith
12-28-2007, 05:29 AM
Yael,
Let me find a freezer and then we'll talk!

Frank Needham
12-29-2007, 04:56 PM
This sort of thought provoking thread is what keeps me coming back to PM. As I was out yesterday with the family grocery shopping we happened to stop in at Food4Less, your local bargain basement type food store. Well, I began looking more closely at the meats they have there and noticed beef heart, kidney, tongue, and tripe. In the poultry section they had Foster Farms, http://www.fosterfarms.com/, turkey and chicken. We bought some chicken livers home, sauteed them with onion, garlic salt, olive oil, and chipotle for a little southwest flavor. They were excellent. Foster Farms claims that all their products are raised hormone and anitbiotic free. I give a thumbs up based on what I've seen so far for the store and Foster's stuff. Also bought a large pork leg to smoke tommorrow. Can't wait.

sarena kopciel
12-29-2007, 05:06 PM
Just ordered a organic turkey breast and my friend is gonna smoke it in his outdoor smoker. he only uses sea salt I think!

Also made chopped liver. Sauteed organic onions and garlic in lots of olice oil, added in liver, continued to sautee adding in sea salt, bl pepper and some Zaatar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Za'atar). Then a bit later I added in some baby spinach and after that was all warm I let int cool. Later added the whole mixture with some more olive oil, a few omega 3 hard boiled eggs to food processor. Let that swirl around and lo and behold--it was awesome and none of my guests or family knew there was spinach in the mix!

Yael Grauer
12-29-2007, 05:07 PM
http://www.localharvest.org has a lot of resources, possibly including grassfed beef sellers in your area... There's also a link for a website that has just people who sell grassfed beef I have here somewhere...

Jay Cohen
12-29-2007, 05:39 PM
http://www.localharvest.org has a lot of resources, possibly including grassfed beef sellers in your area... There's also a link for a website that has just people who sell grassfed beef I have here somewhere...

This site is also pretty good:

http://www.eatwellguide.org/index.cfm

W/F/S

Yael Grauer
12-29-2007, 08:47 PM
Cool.

I was thinking of http://www.eatwild.com