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Mike ODonnell
06-29-2008, 01:24 PM
Yes there actually is a long thread over at Bodybuilding.com on IF...and it's pretty interesting. Looks like more people are trying it and coming around to the idea....what caught my eye the most is the latest post by Alan Aragon, as he is a very smart person and I know had doubts about IF in the past...

I'll go on record & say that I've tried Martin's approach on clients who travel a lot (or drive around a lot during the day), and the results have been very positive. Seeing it work in the field has shifted my perspective of the whole IF thing, particularly the way Martin lays it out.
from http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=3587831&page=103

Martin's approach being the daily IF approach with pwo meals cal & carb timing. (You can see it in more detail here (http://projectfit.org/iflifeblog/2008/06/27/intermittent-fasting-guest-post-sure-fire-fat-loss/))

Very interesting....will have to continue to keep an eye on that thread...

Liam Dougherty Springer
06-29-2008, 02:01 PM
I don't think they really get it. The ones who pratice seem to be speaking about how well it works and the ones who don't seem to be saying how there is no way it could work....

....What?

I wanted to post but then I had to register and I don't know if I wanted to post to help them or brag. Then again I would be probably talking to a bunch of guys who are perfectly well versed in their own practices I could learn a thing or to from them, and who am I to try and teach. I am just kinda flyin by.

:D The thing I believe would help a body builder understand the IF aproach to muscle gain or fat loss is not the effect on the metabolism but anibolic and catabolic states. The ability to use less food more efficiantly is a bennifit of a slower metabolism along with increased ability to synthesise protien and store glycogen vs. useing stored energy more apropriatly. This does have to do with insulin sesitivity which I saw some posts about in the thread. However many of them probrably don't underst and the coralation. Alot of the products I have seen for body builders only talk about insulin as a hormone which needs to be increased.

There seems to be very little info out there on the fact that periods without insulin and without protein intake can actualy increase your ability to use the insulin to build muscle when the dietary protein is present. As well as help you to use fat as energy more efficiantly thus spareing the breakdown of muscle for energy. Some of the guys I know who just want to get big eat so much crapy food and sooooo much meat and whey protein that at some point I beleive they have jacked their metabolizm up so high and lowered their insuline sensitivity so far that their body has turned to using protien as its prefered source of energy. That makes both gains and apropriate losses in weight nearly impossible. Actualy probably completely impossible.

I don't really know where I am going with this but it is a good thread for thought and conversation as to the way our forum parallels the diferent takes of others in the fitness world on similar theories and practices.

Mike ODonnell
06-29-2008, 02:24 PM
If your average bodybuilding crowd can even entertain the fact that they don't need to eat protein every 3 hours....there is some hope.

I'm just surprised the thread has lasted over there.....figured it would of died off in the first 10 pages.

Best way for anyone to know what does and doesn't work....is to just try it. As the beliefs people hold onto the longest...are the ones you try to forcibly tell them how wrong they are....but if they can see it for themselves, they can drop them effortlessly.

Martin Berkhan
06-29-2008, 04:38 PM
That thread is a mishmash of informational posts and trolls.

Discussion has started to get semi-intelligent recently, as more people are trying it and liking it. Anyone interested would be best advised to start from the end.

Derek Weaver
06-29-2008, 06:00 PM
Nice to see Martin post here... I'll have to check out that BB.com thread.

Steve Liberati
06-29-2008, 06:58 PM
If your average bodybuilding crowd can even entertain the fact that they don't need to eat protein every 3 hours....there is some hope.

Big IF'er myself (well over a year now:)) and still trying to fight off this mindset on a daily basis. The bb mags and boards got me young...and planted a bug in my head that if I don't eat at least every 2 hours, I'm going to shriver away and die. Its scary man.

Kevin Perry
06-29-2008, 07:52 PM
Sorry but I don't have the patience to read 110 pages of that thread mainly because my patience ran thin with the BB.com crowd long ago. But if people are finally starting to realize the benefits of IF then good on them. But the BB crowd still outnumbers the IF crowd.

Mike ODonnell
06-29-2008, 08:18 PM
Sorry but I don't have the patience to read 110 pages of that thread mainly because my patience ran thin with the BB.com crowd long ago. But if people are finally starting to realize the benefits of IF then good on them. But the BB crowd still outnumbers the IF crowd.

I hear ya...like Martin said...most of it is the usual BS of trolls and BB mantra...but the last couple of pages seem to have a little relevant info of people giving it a shot....if nothing else it gives you a new appreciation of the PMenu forum....and what it's not

Yep Steve I hear you about the brainwashing....still trying to rub off my "EAS" tattoo from 95......

Liam Dougherty Springer
06-29-2008, 10:32 PM
Iif nothing else it gives you a new appreciation of the PMenu forum....and what it's not..


Thats the truth I am so glad I fell into this crowed at the time I did I had spent alot of time away from healthy eating and exercise and am extreemly open minded and willing to experiment.

The results of devoteing myself to Paleo/Zone IF and CF ME black Box life style have really been mind boggling.:)