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George Mounce
10-12-2008, 06:45 AM
Background:

My father is 55 and stuck in his ways (my mom is 54 and will do some of this as well). But he likes KBs and he likes rings. He is pissed that he gets beat in racquetball now. He likes to row, he likes to canoe, he likes to bike, and he'll run if he has to. He is what I would call "skinny fat" though. He won't do barbell or dumbbell work, and that's fine. He will do all BW work as well (push-ups, ring pull-ups, air squats) and variations of things with KBs.

What I need help with is designing a KB + ring + BW exercise program. I have read the comments Steven Low has made about developing a ring program here: http://www.performancemenu.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3141

Request:

What would be the best way to design a program incorporating these three elements?

Would it be something like this?

Row/Run
Dynamic flexibility drills
Static flexibility drills (they both need to work these until they gain flexibility back)
KB exercises
Ring exercises
BW exercises in metcon type workout

Thanks for the big brain help on this one! Get me started and I can go from there!

I didn't know where to post this type of program request, move if needed!

GM

Chris H Laing
10-12-2008, 07:49 AM
First, have your dad take a look at the (basically) final set-up of the workout plan from that thread. I think Steven and I got it hashed out pretty well(thanks steven!).

But, instead of having your dad do a barbell movement, just put in another ring or weighted body weight exercise. Also he should probably do something for legs, like pistols in sprints (also recommended by steven) since, in all likely hood, he wont be doing anything for legs besides high rep air squat, or KB squats.

The other things, rowing and kettlebells, can be included in the metcons, along with easier bw exercises, like pull-ups and push-ups. I am getting a kettlebell soon, and this is exactly what I plan on doing for my CF style workouts on days I can't to the affiliate. One that looks really fun from the old crossfit archives:

Perform 3-5 Rounds of this circuit.
Kettlebell Swing, 15 reps
"L" Pull-ups, 10 reps
(I would do 5 rounds :p )

This seems like exactly the kind of thing your dad would like. :D

Mike ODonnell
10-12-2008, 07:54 AM
I'd give him a simple circuit to follow 2-3x a week and change up the exercises. Like an EDT or metcon/rounds variation using BW, KB and rings. I would not rush it but let him go at his pace. Make the reps a bit lower but you can also up the weights so they are challenging (like using a 12RMax for sets of 5 Reps).

Example: One day could be do the circuit of 5 KB presses (per arm), 5 inverted rows on rings and then 10 lunges. Then just switch up the workout the next time using an upper body push, pull and lower body movement. He doesn't need to run around quickly as the short rest will be challenging enough, just go at a pace to insure good form and not injure himself.

Steven Low
10-12-2008, 08:22 AM
What are his goals? Just get better at racquetball or is there more things he wants to improve?

If it's JUST racquetball... some type of circuit like MOD is saying is probably best. Get the metcon/tabata/HIIT/circuit conditioning up and he'll have the extra wind to spare when playing...

George Mounce
10-12-2008, 10:42 AM
What are his goals? Just get better at racquetball or is there more things he wants to improve?

If it's JUST racquetball... some type of circuit like MOD is saying is probably best. Get the metcon/tabata/HIIT/circuit conditioning up and he'll have the extra wind to spare when playing...

Its racquetball, but overall life functionality as well.

George Mounce
10-12-2008, 10:44 AM
First, have your dad take a look at the (basically) final set-up of the workout plan from that thread. I think Steven and I got it hashed out pretty well(thanks steven!).

But, instead of having your dad do a barbell movement, just put in another ring or weighted body weight exercise. Also he should probably do something for legs, like pistols in sprints (also recommended by steven) since, in all likely hood, he wont be doing anything for legs besides high rep air squat, or KB squats.

The other things, rowing and kettlebells, can be included in the metcons, along with easier bw exercises, like pull-ups and push-ups. I am getting a kettlebell soon, and this is exactly what I plan on doing for my CF style workouts on days I can't to the affiliate. One that looks really fun from the old crossfit archives:

Perform 3-5 Rounds of this circuit.
Kettlebell Swing, 15 reps
"L" Pull-ups, 10 reps
(I would do 5 rounds :p )

This seems like exactly the kind of thing your dad would like. :D

For legs I was thinking lunges, KB deadlifts/KB suitcase deadlifts, pistols, air squats, jumping squats.

I also am thinking of having incorporate sandbag training, as this would be more to his liking then a barbell.

Chris H Laing
10-13-2008, 06:05 PM
For legs I was thinking lunges, KB deadlifts/KB suitcase deadlifts, pistols, air squats, jumping squats.

Don't forget overhead squats :D

I also am thinking of having incorporate sandbag training, as this would be more to his liking then a barbell.

Thats an excellent idea! I'm now going to include some sandbag stuff in my metcons as well.

Leo Soubbotine
10-13-2008, 07:14 PM
I'd personally write up about 30 workouts or so, put it on cards and throw them in a hat and make him pull out one a day 2-3 days a week and do it. Once all the wod's would be done (2 months or so) - write up new, more challenging ones.

Something like

WOD 1
How many rounds in 10 minutes of
10 Swings
10 Pushups
10 Situps

WOD 2
Three rounds for time
Run 400 meters
20 Jumping pullups
20 Pushups

WOD 3
Pushups with feet elevated: work up to the highest set of five you can.
Elevate your feet a few inches every set

WOD 4
Five rounds
20 air squats
15 swings
10 pullups

and so forth.

Hard to tell without knowing how strong he is but that would work pretty darn well. I train quite a few 55+ in our gym on a daily basis and it's quite fun to get those guys strong and fit. One of them just deadlifted 286 and he's in his early 60's. :D

You can see two of those folks in the "Everyman's gymnastics" video that got posted on CF.com

Allen Yeh
10-14-2008, 04:08 AM
I like Leo's idea. I was thinking the other day when I first read the thread the whole dice as a randomizer might be fun for your dad as well. So on a strength oriented day at the end use the dice to decide your finisher for the day. 1 could be tabata squats, 2 could be 2k row....etc

I'm really enjoying the KB long cycle stuff with the c+j I think that would be worthy to throw in there as something different from a CF type metcon. If you want more LC info just let me know.

George Mounce
10-14-2008, 05:26 AM
Leo, excellent idea.

If you want more LC info just let me know.

Yes please!

Allen Yeh
10-14-2008, 06:48 AM
I orginally posed a LC question to Shaf and here is his lengthy and detailed response:

I'd initially say go 1 Arm LC (1ALC). It's less technical (and easier to start extending the sets). However, 2ALC is just one of the best bangs for the buck you can get using kettlebells.

The general heirarchy with this stuff is:

1. Light kbs, work on technique (including where to find rest at, in the LC movements, this isn't quite as critical because of the clean portion, but you'd rest in the rack and overhead, for both 1A and 2A movements). Increase time.
2. Increase RPMs
3. Increase Weight.

It looks like you're going ~ 5-6 RPM with the regular LC (which is good). With the 1ALC you can probably bump it up to 8-10.

The benefits start accruing, in my admittedly limited experience, ~4 minutes (total work with 2 kbs, or one hand work with 1kbs)

I really prefer the feel of these sets (as per heart rate and perceived exertion) to be like that of a hard 2-3 mile run. Not "holy shit I gotta lay down now I'm done" like Crossfit stuff.

You can do the intensive sets a separate day, if you like that sort of work with the kbs.

~30-50 reps per set with the swings is what Cate Imes (and the other competitive GS folks) recommend. There's no rest to be found while swinging, and it can ramp up fast. Of course, you can do timed deliberate LC work, then some ass busting swings.

I noticed work capacity gains after about 2 weeks. It was kind of subtle, but stuff like shoveling snow got much less fatiguing, and there was just kind of a general feeling of being "more fit". Didn't get as winded during short runs, etc.

Just lay out some sort of logical progression in time.

To give you something to shoot for, Eric Liford, of the AKC, who'd let himself get out of shape, started doing the mythical AKC fitness program and wound up here (and ended up losing ~20 lbs of fat without dieting)

3 sets of 6 minutes of 24kg 1ALC (3 minutes each hand)...30 seconds in between the sets, at 10 RPM

Then he repeated the same thing after resting a few minutes

So, it was, all said and done, 36 minutes of continuous work, overall. He said he was generally done in under 45 minutes, often even quicker. I think he did this between 3-6 times a week, depending on how busy he was.

Of course, the AKC Fitness program has logical progression to it (but I've never seen that program). When I met Eric last December, I wouldn't have thought he'd be able to walk up 4 flights of stairs without stopping.

Allen Yeh
10-14-2008, 06:55 AM
Some more LC info:

Shaf: I think I've mentioned before, I do the vast majority of my work with the 16s. The 24s still kick my ass in timed work

Allen: I'm doing ok with the 35's I think, 8 minutes, switching on the minute ~11 reps an arm.

Shaf: Start with 2 minute sets, then. It changes the dynamic quite a bit, makes it a bit harder in some ways, despite being more deliberate. Still keep the 8 minutes total time. TAke a hit on teh RPM if you have to. Becoming tolerant of the positions is a big part of it, and that requires stepping away from the "do as much work in as little time" mindset.

Allen: Stupid question, I'm supposed to rerack after the jerk right? I wasn't thinking on some reps and dropping it straight down

Shaf: Yeah. clean/rack/jerk/rack/clean. Look to put your elbow on top of your iliac crest on your hips. I think that Smet has a good visual on his blog:
http://girevoysportafter40.blogspot.com/2008/08/flexibility-in-gs.html
I have to remind myself to reposition myself close to the first picture. Straight legs, leaning back, elbow on hip.

Darryl Shaw
10-15-2008, 06:18 AM
George, if you're interested in the long cycle you might find this video useful (Link (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=etB3-bwtm84)) along with this article from americankettlebellclub.com (Link (http://www.americankettlebellclub.com/blog/?m=200709)).

George Mounce
10-15-2008, 06:59 AM
Thank you both awesome stuff!

Garrett Smith
10-15-2008, 08:23 AM
George,
Just a thought, to integrate flexibility training and some BW work together (and guarantee stretching time), you may want your parents to look into some form of yoga.

I've heard good things about the YRG program (http://www.yrgworkoutllc.com/joomla/), I personally like Anusara (http://anusara.com/).

If they are hesitant about the other "non-stretching" aspects of yoga, the YRG program or a YogaFit (http://www.yogafit.com/) class would likely suit them best.

I have found that I won't stretch unless I go to a yoga class or I specifically work stretches into my lifting routine (as in sets of a different "exercise").

George Mounce
10-15-2008, 09:45 PM
Thanks for the reply Garrett. My dad and mom actually love teh dynamic flexibility stretches I showed them when they were here. They loved the OHS with PVC so much when they went back home the first place they went was Lowe's and spent a 1.75 on a piece of PVC!

joe waguespack
11-02-2008, 11:29 AM
A quick effective WO I used a lot is a Swing/Goblet squat alternating ladder:

An example of a 1-10 ladder would be:
10 swings/1 Goblet Squat
9 swings/2 Goblet squats
8 swings....... and so on
The two movements flow well into each other and if you do it without setting the KB down it can get pretty intense if loaded properly or with higher rep ladders

I tend to use a lot of ladder progressions (RKC) in KB/BW workouts

Another good one is a KB clean+press/ pullup ladder:
1 C+P each arm/1 pullup
2 C+P each arm/2 pullups....

I will usually do 3 rounds of a 1-6 ladder and get a pretty good WO

THe possibilities with KB complexes + BW are pretty much endless. And definitely don't forget to teach him a Turkish Get Up, thats a great full body blaster that gets the heart pumping, builds balance and full body strength.

Good luck.

George Mounce
11-07-2008, 07:50 PM
A quick effective WO I used a lot is a Swing/Goblet squat alternating ladder:

An example of a 1-10 ladder would be:
10 swings/1 Goblet Squat
9 swings/2 Goblet squats
8 swings....... and so on
The two movements flow well into each other and if you do it without setting the KB down it can get pretty intense if loaded properly or with higher rep ladders

I tend to use a lot of ladder progressions (RKC) in KB/BW workouts

Another good one is a KB clean+press/ pullup ladder:
1 C+P each arm/1 pullup
2 C+P each arm/2 pullups....

I will usually do 3 rounds of a 1-6 ladder and get a pretty good WO

THe possibilities with KB complexes + BW are pretty much endless. And definitely don't forget to teach him a Turkish Get Up, thats a great full body blaster that gets the heart pumping, builds balance and full body strength.

Good luck.

Thanks for the idea, will be a great addition to the program I'm creating!