View Full Version : "Chinese" Style Lifts
01-25-2009, 10:37 AM
Where did the Chinese method of high-pulls and rows come from and why? I know with some searching I've found that Chinese pulls were used by Dave Sheppard even before they were cool. (http://www.oldtimestrongman.com/blog/2008/05/dave-sheppard-training-at-york-gym.html)
What are the purposes of doing pulls and reversing direction? What is the purpose of doing rows lying prone on a bench?
02-27-2009, 09:53 PM
Bump? Seriously, no one has any input?
02-27-2009, 10:36 PM
eh maybe to fully engage and recruit the fibers and create a new adaptation? Im not familiar with Chinese style lifts.
03-01-2009, 10:26 PM
not really sure, my friend went and trained in china for a while with some of the lifters. the one coach said they do lots of extra muscle work to help prevent injury. but I really dont have a expert or scientific explination. they do lots of upright rows, pull higher on clean pulls. He said that he saw a few of the girl lifters doing kipping pull ups. and a lot of the lifters do isolation stuff also, like curls and tricep ext. and wrist curls and what not. I started doing more upright rows and pulling my cleans higher, my power clean starting getting a lot better. actually I can power clean my PR for squat clean.
03-02-2009, 08:21 AM
Aaccording to Ma Jianping, who was a member of the Chinese National team a number of years ago and then a coach of the Junior National team and coach to a couple of Olympians, they do them this way to more perfectly mimic the top of the regular clean and snatch. The change of direction from pulling to going under is one of the most important parts of the lift, and regular pulls dont train this.
As far as the other exercises, Ma explained to me that they believe that racially the Chinese are not as "muscular" or strong as some other ethnic groups, especially in the upper body, thus they need to do extra work to build muscles, which some other lifters may not need to do. Dont neccessarily believe this myself, just reporting what someone who should know told me.
03-02-2009, 10:17 AM
The reality is that the only way to accurately replicate the pull of the snatch or clean is to snatch or clean... that movement is predicated on the fact that you will at its end be pulling yourself under the bar. So it's just one more way (of many) to try to do a little better.
I'm not personally convinced it's better than what might be called a more traditional pull, but I do think each has its merits and its place in training. Definitely though I don't believe that style pull should be taught to beginning lifters - it's hard enough to get them to quit pulling with their arms, and this is just confusing (for example, I trained a guy a couple weeks ago who lives in Beijing and is being coached there, and this was a HUGE problem for him).
But for more advanced lifters who don't need to worry so much about things like that, I think it can be valuable. A lot of lifters are weak right in that ROM and have sissy 3rd pulls, so occasionally, I think this can help a bit. Of course, the position you're in is nowhere near where you'll be in a snatch or clean, so how transferable the strength is is questionable.
03-03-2009, 07:18 PM
Coach Pendlay did Ma ever talk to you about some of the restorative measures taken by Chinese weightlifters? I have noticed they have a lot of circular bruises on their bodies, especially their shoulders and their backs, for example;
http://www.flickr.com/photos/dehwang/253229927/ on his right shoulder
I deduce this comes from suction cup therapy.
Did he tell you if they do this or not? Do you believe it is an effective restoration technique?
03-03-2009, 10:28 PM
It is a technique called cupping. (http://www.integrative-healthcare.org/mt/archives/2008/10/cupping_for_mas.html)
In Traditional Chinese Medicine, all pain is related to some form of stagnation, cupping helps to relieve that stagnation in theory. I would guess that would be the major use with Chinese WLers.
03-03-2009, 10:52 PM
Fascinating. Thank you for the link Garrett! I would love to learn more about this technique, I've always wondered if traditional Chinese medicine plays a role in the success of their weightlifters, in addition to their training methods, technique, and of course their work ethic and will to succeed. Do you have any experience with cupping?
03-03-2009, 11:35 PM
I know a lot about the Chinese resoratives. But its not anything I would talk about in a public forum, sorry.
03-04-2009, 07:10 AM
I had to learn the "fire twinkling" method (as described in the link) during school. Like any modality, some people swear by it.
I do think a good part of the success of China's athletes is due to TCM, an organized system of attempting to move the body towards a healthier place. This would be in contrast to Western sports medicine--I once saw a minor league catcher for his back pain, he said all the team docs were doing to manage his back pain was an MRI once a week--so he had to sneak around to get some "real care". Anything is better than that! Combine TCM with modern medicine (used judiciously and when needed) and they have a great approach.
I've since moved on to other modalities to treat pain and improve the health of tissue, mainly "cold" laser aka low intensity laser therapy. On the TCM note, I do actually treat specific acupuncture points with the lasers on a regular basis.
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