View Full Version : Paleo Bowel Movemtns: WTF has happened

daniel lyell
11-16-2009, 04:46 PM

Darryl Shaw
11-17-2009, 05:22 AM
If that's a typical days diet replacing some of the high fat foods with fruit and veggies should fix things for you.

Garrett Smith
11-17-2009, 06:07 AM
Definitely less fat would be a good try.

It was the massive amounts of fat on the Athlete's Zone that was one reason I quit...that and I didn't gain any good weight even though I felt like my job was eating fat...

Brian Stone
11-17-2009, 06:14 AM
The best success I've had with putting on weight (what is working currently) is just massive eating. It's going to be tough to fit into the confines of Paleo/Zone and accomplish that, but it can be done, just more slowly.

My opinion is that you need to ramp up the carbs to an extent. Fats are calorie dense, but at the same time they don't digest quickly and make it harder to eat a sufficient quantity of food. I would say that should also have the ancillary benefit of resolving the issue reported herein as well.

Just a thought - this may not be an attractive option for you.

EDIT: I x-posted with you and Dr. G. If you are careful w/ your calorie intake and carbs, you can gain mass w/o significant fat. You just have to ramp up the cals / carbs gradually until you start to put on mass w/o appreciable fat gain.

Darryl Shaw
11-17-2009, 06:55 AM
How would I properly tweak the diet for strength gain without making me a fat***. Just of note, I'm prepping for a ******* school program in two months. Basically it will be about two hours a day of Murph. Thats the best way I can think to describe it. So getting fat in the name of strength is not worth it at all to me. My metcons need to stay stellar.

On the flip side, though, I figured that extra strength should be a huge help. Hence attempting to gain some mass.

Under ideal conditions it takes an extra 700-1000kcals/d to gain 0.5-1kg of lean body mass per week so you've got some eating ahead of you if you're going to achieve your goals but you don't have to go crazy adding huge amounts of fat to your diet to do that.

As you've got a limited time to gain some weight I suggest that you forget about fad diets or dumb advice from internet fitness gurus and concentrate on following a good sports nutrition program such as the one outlined in the factsheets listed here (http://www.ausport.gov.au/ais/nutrition).

After you're done reading those click here (http://www.runningdeersoftware.com/products/dietgenie-calorie-req.htm) to get an estimate of how many calories you need per day to gain weight then set the carbs, fat and protein to 65%, 20% and 15% respectively. I know you're going to ask why high carbs? so here's the answer; carbs are your bodies preferred fuel, they help you train longer and harder and if there's a slight surplus at the end of the day it'll oxidise them for heat (thermogenesis ) thereby increasing your BMR rather than storing them as fat. Carbs also have a significant protein sparing effect so high carb diets result in less protein being used for fuel and more being used to build muscle.

Garrett Smith
11-17-2009, 07:14 AM
Hey, you want to know one way to NOT gain weight?

Have the shits all day, every day. :eek:

Your choice.

daniel lyell
11-17-2009, 09:13 AM
Roger that - so instead of getting my body fat adopted, I should return to a high carb, low fat diet to gain muscle and stay highly competitive in metcons. So is the high fat low carb thing a giant myth? Are Barry Sears and Robb Wolf just talking out their a**? If so - I'll switch back over. I just want whats best for my body performance-wise. I'm not bound to any particularly eating regiment.

Garrett Smith
11-17-2009, 09:37 AM
Try 2x fat first. Reduce as necessary. You can definitely fill in with protein and carbs to make up the difference.

Not everybody tolerates that amount of fat, you might be one. Just find what works for you...Robb would say the same, I would guess.

Brian Stone
11-17-2009, 10:12 AM
It's not a myth; high fat is a great diet for many and works well depending on your goals. However, I would suggest that if you are doing anything that requires v. high caloric intake and/or sustained performance/weight gain that at least moderate carbs are the way to go.

The basis of Dr Sears et al. is hyperinsulinemia, which is very real and is serious. I would not suggest you eschew fat altogether; only that going v. low carb / high fat, given your goals and reactions, may not be right for you. That doesn't mean ditch the fat or eat a bunch of pasta, only that you should moderate your macro ratios and total calories in a manner that is more in line with what you're trying to do and how your body is reacting.

jake oleander
11-17-2009, 10:17 AM
Oh forgot to add - the ***** program is seven weeks long, 5-6 days a week.

any weight you gain will be shed during that program and you'd have to eat like a lion to maintain anything on that sort of training.
lol @ murph 6 days a week, I'm about your size (same body-type, hard-gainer, etc) if i did that I know for a fact I'd lose 15lbs of muscle.

Scott Kustes
11-17-2009, 11:36 AM
And if you want to get strong, ditch all the metcons and start lifting weights as your main focus for awhile. 5/3/1 or Starting Strength.

Brian Stone
11-17-2009, 03:19 PM
With that amount of output, you're going to have to eat a ridiculous amount if you're going to hope to gain any mass. Really, I'd suggest eating as much as you're able to get down between those workouts. Heavy sugar or hi-gly carbs might not work well for you, but you're going to need to get calorie density from something. Whole milk, ice cream, lots of nuts, rice, whole grains, red meat, whole eggs, etc. I wouldn't even worry about blocks if I were you, but that's just me.

Nutrition and eating clean are one thing, but the other thing to consider is your digestive system; you're not going to be exactly getting the opportunity to eat paleo foods when you're in ranger school. I'd suggest getting your body used to the kind and types of foods you'll eat there (probably really calorie-dense) so that you don't have a digestive shock when you show up. If you've ever eaten super clean for a while and then re-introduced "normal" foods and seen how it affects you, you probably don't want that kind of system shock when you enter Ranger school.

I'd worry less about the macros and blocks and more about getting tons of cals, making sure you have plenty of protein and quality stuff in general.

Brian Stone
11-17-2009, 06:13 PM
Ok thanks for the advice. I'm a little confused though as you say to attempt to eat quality stuff in general...but earlier on ice cream is mentioned. Could you clarify that?

Also, I'm only trying to gain mass before the tap starts - hehe I don't count on being able to gain any during. I'll be struggling to maintain weight then.

I don't think ice cream is too bad; it gets a bad rap. It's pretty low-glycemic if you get a variety that's relatively bullshit free (bullshit being peanut butter cups etc. - aka the delicious stuff). But as far as eating "quality" I just mean avoid things like sodas and chocolate bars and other super high-glycemis stuff that has little to no value nutritionally. You can make gains with these (like anything), and w/ your aggressive routine it probably won't make a difference anyway, but I prefer the better stuff, and personally tend to feel better if I manage to adhere to it.

On a separate note, you know your own body, but for many 6% BF is going to be a detriment to sustained performance. It might do you some good to up the BF a bit prior to entry as well, but that's more a matter of how your body functions for you over periods if deprived of food. I'm also not familiar with the types of stuff they'll put you through in Ranger school, so mileage may vary and all that. Just putting that out there.