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Justin Silverman
01-04-2010, 07:50 AM
If my goals are to increase strength and improve at the olympic lifts, would it be best to jump into the performance menu workouts now or do starting strength for 4 - 6 months and then start with the performance menu workouts...or something completely different? All advice would be greatly appreciated

Age: 28
Height: 6'
Weight: 86kg

1 Rep Max:
Snatch - 80kg
Clean and Jerk - 100kg
Back Squat - 116kg

Thanks and I appreciate everything you guys do. Working out at Catalyst Athletics is one of a handful of reasons I can't wait to move back to the Bay Area.

Jay Ashman
01-04-2010, 08:01 AM
I don't see an issue with jumping into the Catalyst workouts at all.

Arden Cogar Jr.
01-04-2010, 08:56 AM
I don't see an issue with jumping into the Catalyst workouts at all.


Absolultey agreed on that!!

All the best,
Arden

Justin Silverman
01-04-2010, 09:16 AM
Any thoughts on just jumping in with today's workout or starting at the beginning of the last cycle?

Thanks

Jay Ashman
01-04-2010, 09:21 AM
Hmmm, that I can't answer at all, not sure of how CA structures their workouts and how long each cycle is. I think someone who does them would be able to answer them.

I wish I had the equipment handy they use, I would do CA workouts in a heartbeat.

Arden Cogar Jr.
01-04-2010, 09:36 AM
Current CAWOD:

. Back squat - 85% x 2 x 4
. Snatch deadlift - 105% x 3 x 3
. Push press - 78% x 4 x 5

I'd say as long as you know what you're maxes are and you adequately "warm up" going into these top sets, you will be fine. Nothing about those percentages on those movements is going to cause any great concern - but I would use the max on your snatch deadlift as your current snatch and work on doing these as a pull without the extension above the crease in the hip.

All the best,
Arden

Jay Ashman
01-04-2010, 09:51 AM
I've always wondered why CA uses 78% and other odd percentages rather than rounding up or down to the nearest 5%. I'm sure there is a great reason for it, I just usually go by 5% increments, but I assume the more advanced you get, the smaller the margin of error is with these lifts and every percentage counts dramatically.

Arden Cogar Jr.
01-04-2010, 10:15 AM
I am guessing variability in the overall planning template. Plus the mesocycles seem to run on 12 week programs. At least from my casual observation over the year. Very solid, IMO. Plus, it's hard to push 80 to 80% for 5s after doing two exercises before hand, at least in my experience. Not impossible, just hard.

All the best,
Arden

I've always wondered why CA uses 78% and other odd percentages rather than rounding up or down to the nearest 5%. I'm sure there is a great reason for it, I just usually go by 5% increments, but I assume the more advanced you get, the smaller the margin of error is with these lifts and every percentage counts dramatically.

Jay Ashman
01-04-2010, 10:47 AM
I am guessing variability in the overall planning template. Plus the mesocycles seem to run on 12 week programs. At least from my casual observation over the year. Very solid, IMO. Plus, it's hard to push 80 to 80% for 5s after doing two exercises before hand, at least in my experience. Not impossible, just hard.

All the best,
Arden

you are probably right on about that. I will admit I don't have much experience at all with Oly Lifts, coaching them and planning a cycle around them, but I can admit that instead of faking my way through it. Barbell training however I am golden...

Its an area that I want to learn more about and am reading books about it now to get an idea of how to plan the cycles and what to do.

In the meantime CA has a ton of success with what they do and I don't think anyone can go wrong following their program at all, once I get the equipment needed to do it, I will do a 12 week cycle of theirs.

Arden Cogar Jr.
01-04-2010, 12:18 PM
you are probably right on about that. I will admit I don't have much experience at all with Oly Lifts, coaching them and planning a cycle around them, but I can admit that instead of faking my way through it. Barbell training however I am golden...

Its an area that I want to learn more about and am reading books about it now to get an idea of how to plan the cycles and what to do.

In the meantime CA has a ton of success with what they do and I don't think anyone can go wrong following their program at all, once I get the equipment needed to do it, I will do a 12 week cycle of theirs.

Here's what I had to do:
1. Bought about 300 pounds in cheap bumper plates (kraiburgs at rubberman);
2. bought a decent bar (York training or Pendlay HD)
3. tossed my ego out the window;
4. thought speed and technical precision;
5. spent tons of time watching videos and asking questions on boards like this on technical issues;
6. read everything I could get my hands on;
7. if you don't have access to a coach, videotape your technical lifts and ask periodic critques on boards like this one seeking technical evaluations;
8. when you get your feed back on your critiques, write it all down, and only focus on one thing each set you perform. Trying to do too many will result in utter confusion.
9. be hella patient; it's a long term process.

All the best,
Arden

Jay Ashman
01-04-2010, 12:41 PM
Here's what I had to do:
1. Bought about 300 pounds in cheap bumper plates (kraiburgs at rubberman);
2. bought a decent bar (York training or Pendlay HD)
3. tossed my ego out the window;
4. thought speed and technical precision;
5. spent tons of time watching videos and asking questions on boards like this on technical issues;
6. read everything I could get my hands on;
7. if you don't have access to a coach, videotape your technical lifts and ask periodic critques on boards like this one seeking technical evaluations;
8. when you get your feed back on your critiques, write it all down, and only focus on one thing each set you perform. Trying to do too many will result in utter confusion.
9. be hella patient; it's a long term process.

All the best,
Arden
a bunch of guys and I are buying a bumper plate set for us to use at the gym, for my training (and clients) and their training as well. After that is a couple good bars (Oly bars) so I will go from there. I hate doing Oly Lifts with the bars the gym has...

Arden Cogar Jr.
01-04-2010, 01:21 PM
a bunch of guys and I are buying a bumper plate set for us to use at the gym, for my training (and clients) and their training as well. After that is a couple good bars (Oly bars) so I will go from there. I hate doing Oly Lifts with the bars the gym has...


The main thing to do is buy one or two decent bars - I actulaly prefer the Pendlay HD because it's standard on the distance between the collars and the knurlings. And given your height and arm length, you should be snatching with your hands against the collars - which, IMO, makes it a lot easier to understand how to recieve the bar on the snatch.

The York training bar is about 2" wider at he collars and a normal human really can't hold it collar to collar like the Pendlay/werksan/Eelko (sp). Now the York comp bar (which is $650) does have those measurements. Which I always found weird.

Anyway, just get two decent bars and don't let them go near a squat rack, a bench or a power cage. Those absolutely destroy the knurling where you will be gripping for your snatch.

If you do not have that luxury, put some leather or tape on the "bar holders" of the benches, squat racks, or power cages at your gym so the bars knurling doesn't get destroyed.

But I hear ya. I really hate doing snatches at the YMCA I train at ocassionally. I don't mind cleans as that part of the bar doesn't get banged up. But snatches make it hard.

Good luck.

All the best,
Arden

Michael McKenna
01-05-2010, 01:24 PM
You know, I jump my hands out when I snatch and go collar to collar. Many, many times I jump the collars and hit plates when I snatch.

But you did say normal human being, not gorillas.

Arden Cogar Jr.
01-05-2010, 02:33 PM
You know, I jump my hands out when I snatch and go collar to collar. Many, many times I jump the collars and hit plates when I snatch.

But you did say normal human being, not gorillas.

Mike,
I start with my hands against the collars. I'm 5'10" and 76" from finger tip to finger tip. I'm more of a orangutan; but a lot less hairy.

:-D

All the best,
Arden

Justin Arnold
01-05-2010, 06:58 PM
You would probably be damn good at bouldering, fwiw.

Timothy Holmes
01-06-2010, 02:27 AM
You would probably be damn good at bouldering, fwiw.

... or discus.