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View Full Version : Whistling near a graveyard?


Gary John
03-23-2010, 08:23 AM
Kind of notice how the recent death at x-fit was handled very well at IGX, but nada more or less elsewhere.

I owned a rigging company for over 30 years, and that bullseye of killing someone was there everyday.

When everybody is a personal trainer, I'm wondering of how much the actual risks of being that trainer enters into your lives.

Or, is this more like big marathons where somebody croaks in every race?

Kevin Perry
03-23-2010, 09:29 AM
I'm lost, did someone die recently?

Greg Everett
03-23-2010, 10:05 AM
I'm not a doctor, but my limited experience and understanding leads me to believe, as has been said elsewhere, that the nature of her death was one not really caused by CF - it was likely a genetic predisposition, and the precipitating event could have been just about anything. That being said, I do find it odd that the place will exploit the deaths of soldiers for its own benefit (if you really want to help, send the widows and their kids some of that money, and don't advertise it), and yet won't even mention this... makes me envision a bunch of RRG lawyers scrambling madly around the war room trying to erase all evidence of the Company's association. I don't think any trainer or coach, no matter how experienced or credentialed, would have seen it coming. I know of AAA and TAA deaths that had zero apparent direct cause - they just went. There are a lot of ignorant, irresponsible CF trainers doing ignorant, irresponsible CF stuff out there and hurting people unnecessarily, but I don't think this counts - it could have happened in any gym with any trainer; or outside the gym, for that matter.

Best wishes to her family and friends.

Gary John
03-23-2010, 10:06 AM
Yes.

Jonathan Yoon
03-23-2010, 10:11 AM
I'm lost, did someone die recently?

Dede Whitwood, a member of CrossFit Geneseo in New York. She had collapsed during a workout and doctors discovered an aortic tear. They fixed it, but she died a day or two later. The affiliate's website and Facebook have been deleted since Dede's death. The CF forum has one thread that barely had any condolences listed, especially when you compare it to the IGx forum on the same subject. Nothing from CFHQ or the Affiliate blog on the situation either. CF Journal oddly put out an article talking about having affiliates protect their business with liability waivers on the same day as Dede's death.

Jonathan Yoon
03-23-2010, 10:17 AM
I'm not a doctor, but my limited experience and understanding leads me to believe, as has been said elsewhere, that the nature of her death was one not really caused by CF - it was likely a genetic predisposition, and the precipitating event could have been just about anything. That being said, I do find it odd that the place will exploit the deaths of soldiers for its own benefit (if you really want to help, send the widows and their kids some of that money, and don't advertise it), and yet won't even mention this... makes me envision a bunch of RRG lawyers scrambling madly around the war room trying to erase all evidence of the Company's association. I don't think any trainer or coach, no matter how experienced or credentialed, would have seen it coming. I know of AAA and TAA deaths that had zero apparent direct cause - they just went. There are a lot of ignorant, irresponsible CF trainers doing ignorant, irresponsible CF stuff out there and hurting people unnecessarily, but I don't think this counts - it could have happened in any gym with any trainer; or outside the gym, for that matter.

Best wishes to her family and friends.

You'd think that there would be an outpouring of condolences and something from CFHQ. There was more (forgive the term) "Boo Hoo-ing" over the drama with CrossFit Obsession and an actual statement from CFHQ about it "caring and protecting their own." Seems that this situation is just being blatantly ignored. Not a peep of "So sorry for your loss" from anyone in-charge of anything.

Gary John
03-23-2010, 10:43 AM
I was kind of curious how most of you would react to this.

I can hear wagons circling from here. (at x-fit for those who lost their decoing ring)

Mike ODonnell
03-23-2010, 10:47 AM
Sad. No one likes hearing things like this....and like said above, could happen to any trainer in any gym too. Hopefully some good comes from it with trainers being more aware of their client's health and their training programming.

Reminds me of how you have to hear about at least one HS football kid dying of heat stroke every year during the August 2x/days (esp in the south).

Allen Yeh
03-23-2010, 02:27 PM
Wow, terrible. My condolences to her family.

Joe Hart
03-23-2010, 06:58 PM
Its terrible that this woman died. It looks like CFHQ is a bunch of jerks by the way it has worked out. Now what the truth is who knows. The Kool-aid drinkers are going to side with CF. The perception to me (Joe average, heh) is that CF is a bag of assholes that only worry about themselves (for example releasing the liabilty waiver article).

If it goes to court it will be UGLY. All those Rhabo shirts and I am sure the injury board would get some attention. CF may get off, but it would hurt.

Gant Grimes
03-24-2010, 08:04 AM
When you have that condition, your time is your time. It could happen in a gym, on the toilet, or watching your favorite TV show.

It shouldn't go to court unless somebody just wants a nuisance settlement. But if it does, that case will continue to build the litigation kit that already includes Glassman's proclamations, the idiotic comments made daily on that forum, and the pukey/rhabdo stuff.

There is nothing that affiliate or trainer could have done. It is a tragedy for them, as well, and that tragedy is compounded by the noticeable absence of any mention by HQ. The waiver article was classless but not surprising.

Condolences to Dede, her family, the affiliate, her trainer, and anyone else involved. Sad deal.

Derek Simonds
03-24-2010, 08:21 AM
When you have that condition, your time is your time. It could happen in a gym, on the toilet, or watching your favorite TV show.

It shouldn't go to court unless somebody just wants a nuisance settlement. But if it does, that case will continue to build the litigation kit that already includes Glassman's proclamations, the idiotic comments made daily on that forum, and the pukey/rhabdo stuff.

There is nothing that affiliate or trainer could have done. It is a tragedy for them, as well, and that tragedy is compounded by the noticeable absence of any mention by HQ. The waiver article was classless but not surprising.

Condolences to Dede, her family, the affiliate, her trainer, and anyone else involved. Sad deal.

Well said! My condolences as well.

Danny John
03-24-2010, 09:43 AM
I remember back when there was this "cavalier" attitude about rhabdo and killing people in the original interactions with this, Gary. I'm certainly no safety Nazi, but maybe it is the fact that I'm an S and C guy not a Personal Trainer, so we edge towards performance (I like Cook's hierarchy on this, by the way).

If I make a mistake and some one gets hurt, part of what I do is gather the people involved and make serious decisions about what is going on. That is why we don't do Box Jumps, and fine if you do.

I don't know the woman or the family, but I certainly have led our groups in prayer offering any support we can. The hard thing about this is that, as Gary noted, I'm almost "used" to deaths in marathons, but NEVER do people die doing a workout or training period. That's why Pavel insists on "Training Sessions" rather than workout. (Yes, I know, people die Benching, but that is very preventable).

It's a big issue for those of us in the field.

Pat McElhone
03-25-2010, 07:09 PM
I'm not a doctor, but my limited experience and understanding leads me to believe, as has been said elsewhere, that the nature of her death was one not really caused by CF -.....
Best wishes to her family and friends.

Greg really hit the nail on the head. Acute tears of an aortic anuerysm are bad, not sure if Dede's tear was in the abdominal or thoracic region. Thoracic tears are almost 100% fatal. Often times, the patient is revived immediately, but had taken such a hit that too much cellular death had occur and the patient dies a few days later.

Greg hit the nail on the head again with CFHQ silence. The couch thread is the only place I have seen more then a few people express remorse, which says a lot about both places...coach thread and CrossFit.

I am not making light of this...but when she collapsed do you think people thought...oh she needs more salt because her aldosterone is down because she is zoning? Or if her trainer had a sphygmometer the outcome would have been different? Maybe someone out there will realize training people is serious business and if you are going to do, you need to be educated and know what the hell you are doing.

Thoughts and prayers to her family.

Jonathan Yoon
03-26-2010, 08:17 AM
And it's been almost two weeks since Dede collapsed mid-workout and a week since her passing - STILL NOTHING FROM CFHQ.

Although I don't think a sphygmometer would have necessarily changed the outcome based on the situation and the reaction time of the people in the gym. But anyone who becomes a trainer should be aware of things like this and be prepared for it (trained & certified in First Aid, CPR, and the ability to use an AED which should be in the gym along with a fully-packed First Aid Kit). But individuals who take on a fitness program of any kind should get themselves checked before hand as well.

RIP Dede.

Kevin Perry
03-26-2010, 10:34 AM
RIP Dede.

Shame on CFHQ.

Derek Weaver
03-26-2010, 02:11 PM
First, condolences to her family as well as the trainer/owner of the affiliate. I'm sure, as is the case the vast majority of the time, the intentions of the affiliate were good.

While an aortic aneurysm is something that eventually will cause anlife threatening problem regardless of activity, I have a feeling that a lawyer could draw enough of a relationship between CF and Dede's death to cause a bit of a stir and cause some issues for HQ and that affiliate. The Pukie and Rhabdo mascots won't help anything. As well as the whole thing with glassman saying" if breaking your neck is a problem, we don't want you in our ranks" or whatever it said.

Jamie J. Skibicki
03-29-2010, 08:09 AM
"" if breaking your neck is a problem, we don't want you in our ranks""

It was "if the idea of breaking your neck is a problem, we don't want you"


This is something that CFer manage to fuck up as well. The point is not "hey, look at my fucked up hands" which is stupid, macho bullshit which interrupts training. The point is supposed to be "I'm going to do the excersize which, if done wrong could hurt me, but it's much more effective than those that cannot".


You don't want to get injured, but you don't want to avoid doing this that could hurt you.