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Brian Baggetta
04-25-2010, 07:07 PM
Question for anyone who has taken zinc long-term -- how much do you take, and have you had any adverse effects?

This article from Elite FTS (mostly wfs) suggests (via Lights Out) 50 mg twice a day with coffee and a meal:
http://articles.elitefts.com/articles/nutrition/top-nine-supplements-for-football-training/

But (and not that RDA or other gov't recs are especially helpful in all cases), medpedia's National Academy of Sciences rec is no more than 40 mg/day:

http://wiki.medpedia.com/Zinc (wfs)

In case it effects anyone's answer, I'm 32, and currently on a 3-day-a-week SS-style strength cycle . Soon I will shifting to a more 5-3-1 type program and starting to get into prepping for the outdoor track season (100m, discus, hammer) -- not competitive, just for fun.

I also recently started taking ZMA (maybe 6 weeks ago) and have had excellent results in terms of sleep and general recovery, although it's worth it for the dreams alone IMO. The ZMA dose includes 30 mg of zinc.

Just trying to get a sense of whether others have noticed any particular benefits or drawbacks from supplementing zinc more regularly and at higher dosages.

Greg Davis
04-26-2010, 02:32 AM
I think you're safe with up to ~60 mg / day if you know you are deficient..

curious about the zinc with coffee mentioned in the article as I wouldn't guess that would be great for absorption.

Chris Forbis
04-26-2010, 04:21 AM
http://www.funimky.com/downloads/The%20ZINC%20Taste%20Test.pdf

I've been doing significant zinc supplementation for a while and am just now starting to approach "optimal zinc levels" according to the test.

Allen Yeh
04-26-2010, 04:24 AM
Wow that sounds like a lot of Zinc when you are taking 50mg twice a day and then you are taking another 30mg at night. I've only ever taken zinc iwth other things like a multi or ZMA. Never tried it solo. I don't recall that mentioned in Lights Out but I'm probably due for another read soon, it was pretty dense and I have a few take aways but I'm sure I missed way more.

If you do happen to give it a go mind updating how it goes here?

Darryl Shaw
04-26-2010, 04:27 AM
DRI Nutrient Intake Calculator. (http://fnic.nal.usda.gov/interactiveDRI/)

http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/zinc.asp

Jay Ashman
04-26-2010, 04:47 AM
be wary of calcium and copper issues with too much zinc. Everything I have ever read says no more than 50mg per day..... but then again I would like to see the results of 100mg a day with proper dosing of copper and calcium as to avoid the absorption issues.

Allen Yeh
04-26-2010, 05:00 AM
11mg seems absurdly low....for reference I looked at the recommendations of Vitamin D and came up with:

http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamind.asp

200IU? Really? I just don't put much stock into government recomendations of just about anything and certainly not dietary recommendations.

Being 5'9", 192 lbs and for the selection of low active that calculator thinks I need 3000 calories. which are split up like: (weird how I get a huge range for carbs/fats and still come up with 3000 kcals/day)
Carbohydrates - 334 - 482 grams = ~8 - 11.5 cups of raw yam
Protein - 70 grams = 2 small chicken breasts
Fat - 66 - 115 grams = 4.7 - 7.7 tbsp's of coconut oil

Um...that is a heck of a lot of yam

Brian Baggetta
04-26-2010, 05:47 AM
Thanks for the input, everyone.

Yes, Allen, 11mg seemed pretty low to me, particularly as I have been taking 3x that amount for awhile now with no ill effects. But adding another 100mg to the 30 I'm taking seems like a lot, and my copy of Lights Out is currently on loan to a friend, so I haven't been able to read the surrounding text.

Chris, how much have you been taking?

Garrett Smith
04-26-2010, 06:34 AM
If someone tests low on the zinc taste test, I believe Poliquin takes them up to 150mg for a month, then 100mg for several after that.

The taste test is huge, both for finding your level of supplementation necessary, as well as discovering if certain types of zinc don't work for you.

Tony Ferous
04-26-2010, 06:35 AM
I recently bought another bottle of the zinc test liquid, i was deficient according to it, so i started adding 50mg zinc picolinate to breakfast, along with the 30mg from zma in the evening and 7.5 from a multi.
A week later, no change.
Will keep it up for another 2 weeks or so.
Im getting ~333mg Calcium and .3mg copper with lunch. Seems pretty easy to hit 1mg of copper dietarily though, dark chocolate, mushrooms, avocado, walnuts, spinach etc.

Garrett Smith
04-26-2010, 06:56 AM
Just an FYI...men lose a significant amount of zinc in every ejaculation. If you'd like to spend less $$ on zinc and/or get your levels higher faster, well...you know what to avoid doing.

Tony Ferous
04-26-2010, 07:22 AM
Suddenly im less concerned with my own zinc deficiency, i have a novel way to correct my girlfriends though. ;-)

Garrett Smith
04-26-2010, 11:35 AM
Chris,
I'm looking at my zinc sulfate solution and comparing to the PDF you linked...seems like using this liquid to supplement zinc would be slow going. 1 tsp only contains 1.15mg of zinc, so even 6 tsp/day would only be around 7mg of zinc!

I'd say someone should definitely be supplementing some zinc picolinate on top of it if they ever want to get somewhere.

Also, never forget that correcting a deficiency requires different strategy than a maintenance dose. Living paycheck-to-paycheck doesn't leave any $$ to put into savings, much less to pay off accumulated debt! (hopefully the analogy comes across)

Brian Baggetta
04-26-2010, 12:43 PM
FWIW, I cross-posted a similar question on EliteFTS, and the author of that article stated that he has taken up to 150 mg of zinc per day since 1999 or 2000. . .

Garrett Smith
04-26-2010, 01:34 PM
I'm usually in the 90-150mg range per day of zinc picolinate, have been for the last 3 months.

I finally got around to taking the taste test today. I'm finally in the Level 2!!! (adequate zinc levels) That took a long time.

Steven Low
04-26-2010, 02:17 PM
If someone tests low on the zinc taste test, I believe Poliquin takes them up to 150mg for a month, then 100mg for several after that.

The taste test is huge, both for finding your level of supplementation necessary, as well as discovering if certain types of zinc don't work for you.
Yep, Poliquins recommendations are usually pretty good.

The taste test is a good method.

Brian Baggetta
04-26-2010, 04:57 PM
OK, so I grabbed Lights Out @ the library on the way home, and it certainly seems to suggest taking 150 mg twice/day. See p. 187 ("150 milligrams of zinc morning and afternoon blocks prolactin . . . [t]ake it with coffee to enhance dopamine, which also blocks prolactin.").

I promise I haven't left out anything relevant in the ellipsis. I suppose you could read it as 150 total, taken between the morning and the afternoon, but seems more like 300 total to me. . .

Garrett Smith
04-26-2010, 05:21 PM
Might want to look at their reference (if there is one), or go to PubMed and start searching under zinc + prolactin...

Darryl Shaw
04-27-2010, 03:13 AM
11mg seems absurdly low....for reference I looked at the recommendations of Vitamin D and came up with:

http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamind.asp

200IU? Really? I just don't put much stock into government recomendations of just about anything and certainly not dietary recommendations.

Being 5'9", 192 lbs and for the selection of low active that calculator thinks I need 3000 calories. which are split up like: (weird how I get a huge range for carbs/fats and still come up with 3000 kcals/day)
Carbohydrates - 334 - 482 grams = ~8 - 11.5 cups of raw yam
Protein - 70 grams = 2 small chicken breasts
Fat - 66 - 115 grams = 4.7 - 7.7 tbsp's of coconut oil

Um...that is a heck of a lot of yam

Yeah, that sure is a lot of yam.....

Something the low-carb crowd always seem to forget (or choose to ignore) in the high vs. low carb debate is that it's really hard to overeat if you're eating a diet high in minimally processed starchy carbs.

Chris Forbis
04-27-2010, 04:24 AM
Chris,
I'm looking at my zinc sulfate solution and comparing to the PDF you linked...seems like using this liquid to supplement zinc would be slow going. 1 tsp only contains 1.15mg of zinc, so even 6 tsp/day would only be around 7mg of zinc!

I'd say someone should definitely be supplementing some zinc picolinate on top of it if they ever want to get somewhere.


Yeah, I only find the liquid sulfate solution to be useful for testing.

Chris, how much have you been taking?

I had been following the Lights Out recommendation (150mg with meals taken at home... 10-12 doses a week total). Since I now grimace when taking the zinc sulfate liquid, I plan on moving down to 100mg a dose for a month or two and then retesting. I've been using the Source Naturals Zinc product.

Tony Ferous
04-27-2010, 04:43 AM
Chris, aside from the grimace, have you noted any postive results from your presumable zinc repletion?

Dr Michael Colgan notes in one of his books - zinc absortaion varies between 40-02% depending on the food ingested, and losses via ejaculation are only 1mg, athletes could lose 12mg a day via sweat. Hes doesnt recommend more than 50mg.

Im may the now zinc glycinate(albion chelate) when my picolinate runs out.

Chris Forbis
04-27-2010, 05:43 AM
My immune system and general healing are rock solid, though I wouldn't attribute that to zinc alone. Nothing else particularly noticeable. But zinc is cheap.

Garrett Smith
04-27-2010, 06:08 AM
Tony,
It may seem like the loss from ejaculation is minor, however, absorption rates of zinc are quite poor. IIRC, an absorption rate of 5-10% from a supplement would be excellent (most are below this rate, if any reach it at all).

I had not seen the sweat number, but that could easily explain why nearly all athletic people I see are deficient in zinc at loss rates like that.

Chris Forbis
04-29-2010, 05:16 AM
My immune system and general healing are rock solid, though I wouldn't attribute that to zinc alone. Nothing else particularly noticeable. But zinc is cheap.

I will also point out that I am pretty sure I experienced a testosterone boost from increased zinc intake. No concrete numbers, but the occurrence of pitched tents in the morning and such was significantly greater.