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View Full Version : Magnificent Mobility vs Z Health and others


kevin mckay
04-28-2007, 08:11 PM
If you could just use just one what would it be?
I am looking for something simple and straight forward that covers all the bases.

Thanks

Mike ODonnell
04-29-2007, 08:25 AM
I do these....keep me flexible and injury free (knock on wood) enough for sports....that and lots of multidirectional lunges and overhead squats (even if just for warmup)...

http://www.coreperformance.com/workout.php?p=1&s=2&id=2

kevin mckay
04-29-2007, 08:49 AM
Good stuff, thanks Mike.

Steve Shafley
04-29-2007, 10:14 AM
I think it was Alwyn Cosgrove who told me via an email that Verstegen was so far beyond every else in movement prep and mobility that it's ludicrious.

Chuck Kechter
04-29-2007, 10:59 AM
The thing about Verstegen and a few others, are that they tailor the mobility stuff to the athlete, rather than give some cookie-cutter solution -- ala Magnificent Mobility...

Specificity rules.

Rene Renteria
04-30-2007, 04:15 PM
That link from Core Performance plus some judicious searching on T-Nation for Cressey and Robertson articles will get you at least 75% of what's on Magnificent Mobility. I have it and use it and like it but think it is too expensive. It has no real upper body mobility work (not counting the spine b/c there's plenty of that). Instead, one is supposed to buy Robertson and Hartman's "Inside/Out" DVD for another $50 or $60. I think those should have been a single product for the same price, but then I'm a buyer not a seller and not a marketer.

I think Cressey and Robertson have some of the best material over on T-nation, but I'm still a n00b (and always will be).

They posted a list of the exercises that are included in the Mag. Mobil. DVD. Choose 8-12, do for 5 to a dozen reps each depending, build from easy to hard, is what they recommend. I think that's what they say even in the comments over on T-Nation and not just on the DVD. Here's the post with the exercise list:
http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=872088&pageNo=6#bottom

I [Robertson] seriously haven't watched the M2 DVD since it was released. Between edits, reviews, and the like, I'd heard enough of myself talking to last a year! However, several people have asked what exercises are in the program, so I thought I would go in and type it out for any of you that are "on the fence."

EASY:
Cat/Camel
Yoga Twist
Side Twist
Bent Knee Twist
Birddog
Side-Lying Trunk Twist
Calf Stretch
Fire Hydrants
Supine Bridge

MEDIUM:
Single-Leg Supine Bridge
Anterior-Posterior Leg Swings
Side-to-Side Leg Swings
Supine Scorpion
Prone Scorpion
Hip Corrections
Windmills
High Knee Walks
Pull-Back Butt Kicks
Mini-Band Side Steps
Cradle Walks
Scap Push-ups
Overhead Broomstick Dislocates

HARD:
Toy Soldiers
Single Leg RDL
Reverse Warrior Lunge w/Twist
Walking Spiderman
Alternating Lateral Lunge
Squat-to-Stand
Crossover Overhead Reverse Lunge
Running Butt Kicks
High Knee Skips
Deep Wideout Drops
Supine Leg Whips

Allen Yeh
05-01-2007, 03:35 AM
I really like the Core Performance stuff but I have yet to review either MM or Z health so I'm unable to give you a comparison.

Core Performance: Essentials I was able to borrow from the library (somewhat permanently as no one else ever wants it so I've been renewing it for a while now). I think this book was put together pretty well and has a good progression from sedentary to active in terms of movement prep and pre-hab stuff.

Core Performance: Endurance has a bit more information in the pre-hab and recovery sections but is obviously tailored more towards marathoners.

Garrett Smith
05-01-2007, 06:08 AM
I like Z-Health and some of Super Joints. I also use the Renegade Hurdle hip mobility drills and several *cough* "club" exercises for upper body dynamic mobility.

Also, I really like those "foot drills" that were posted here a little while ago. Those are now a permanent part of my warmups.

Ron Nelson
05-01-2007, 10:18 AM
I have MM and have raved about it before. I also shared it with my coaches so they could incorporate some of the movements into warm ups for our athletes.

They still have them run and do a bunch of stretches, while my teams are doing high knee walks, buttkickers, toy soldiers, and the like.

I looked at the Z-Health site, but all I got was that you had to go to certifications to get the basic gist. I'll have to look again.

Did anyone see the CF vid of Greg A. and his warm up? I thought it had merit although I think he was using some "Super Joints" movements.

Steve Shafley
05-01-2007, 10:49 AM
I find myself skeptical with the Z-Health thing. Geoff Neupert's blog is here:

http://www.geoffnsblog.blogspot.com/

He apparently works directly with Dr. Eric Cobb, and is continually messing himself up, despite this. I find the speculations of "neuromuscular poisoning" both distasteful and very hard to believe. I've read a lot of goofy stuff in it, maybe it's goofy because I don't understand, but the is a very distinct pattern to Mr. Neupert's actions:

1. ARGH! I HURT
2. YAY, ZHEALTH TOOK CARE OF IT
3. SINCE I FEEL GREAT, I'M GOING TO DO "X" IN MY TRAINING!
4. ARGH! I HURT

While I am sure the Z-health could be a viable program, if you need to study it for several years and still have it's founder work on you for it to work, then the cost greatly outweighs the benefit.

Garrett Smith
05-01-2007, 11:24 AM
I have found the Z-Health to be decently cost-prohibitive, then again, there were paradigm shifts in my own health-longevity bias that took place there that were worth the $$ IMO.

I really like the foot drills and will be replacing many of the Z-Health foot and ankle drills with them: http://wellness.ndsu.nodak.edu/fitness/Events/marathon/footDrills.pdf . After doing the foot drills followed by my Z-Health drills, I found everything to already be mobilized and ready to go. Those foot drills are a keeper.

What Z-Health (the DVDs) does is isolate all the particular joint movements, better than everything else (especially better than the WW program with all its extra movement "slop"). Without knowingly and purposely isolating a particular joint movement, the body will simply use another joint (that is likely hypermobile) to complete some semblance of the complex movement we're asking it to do. That's why I do both types (simple and complex).

Such as with Verstegen's stuff that was posted. Those movements are so complex that people could do them for years and never know that certain joint movements just weren't happening correctly, due to other joints "picking up the (lack of) slack".

Z-Health as a treatment modality--IMO, only Dr. Cobb has the wisdom and experience to do it well. Is it worth seeing him in a private session? Absolutely. Very well-spent money. Do I feel comfortable treating someone with it? Not really.

Any attempt (however bad) at joint mobility is better than nothing.

Last I heard from a CST jedi, So-non was bringing a suit against Dr. Cobb for stealing his joint mobility exercises (which he stole from someone else, as in the Slavs). Those yoga people better watch out, he's coming for them next...

Steve Shafley
05-01-2007, 11:29 AM
Cobb and Sonnon used to be tight, too.

Steve Shafley
05-01-2007, 11:31 AM
Interestingly enough, Matt Spiller, a PT e-amigo, prescribed those foot drills to me 4-5 years ago. I used to do them quite a bit. I haven't in a while.

Garrett Smith
05-01-2007, 11:48 AM
If there was ever an "active, functional" set of joint mobility exercises for the foot & ankle, those foot drills take the cake.

kevin mckay
05-03-2007, 07:29 AM
Thanks for all the great info

Mike ODonnell
05-03-2007, 09:25 AM
I think mobility is good....but also with the right diet...muscle pulls and tightness really doesn't seem to be such a big issue as others have (or I had years ago).....working out less and doing full ROM and good nutrition......I feel great without even having to try and stretch......something too that as you never see a lion stretching it's hamstrings before a nice run for deer meat....

Garrett Smith
05-03-2007, 11:02 AM
Mike, I agree that diet is the most important part of the whole equation.

Yael Grauer
05-03-2007, 07:09 PM
Mmmmm, deer meat....

kevin mckay
05-03-2007, 10:11 PM
My diet is pretty darn dialed in

Paleo/zone/IF
huge serious green leafy intake
fish oil
calcium magnesium zinc potassium
still need to try zma
Guess I could do more organ meat...

Allen Yeh
05-04-2007, 04:08 AM
If there was ever an "active, functional" set of joint mobility exercises for the foot & ankle, those foot drills take the cake.

I'll be adding these in. I'll let you guys know what I think of these.