Home   |   Contact   |   Help

Get Our Newsletter
Sign up for our free newsletter to get training tips and stay up to date on Catalyst Athletics, and get a FREE issue of the Performance Menu journal.

Go Back   Catalyst Athletics Forums > Training > Endurance

 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Prev Previous Post   Next Post Next
Old 07-14-2008, 11:51 AM   #1
Dave Van Skike
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: PNW
Posts: 1,738
Default Lactate Work/crosspost.

From the P&B.....may be a bucnh of scientifical BS but what I'm hearing from folks I know still involved in the silliness that is bike racing thsi stuff pans out..in....you know... like in the real world and stuff.

........ the current thinking is that lactate per se isn't actually the cause of muscular fatigue. It is a fuel and actually may buffer changes in muscular acidosis and prevent fatigue (this is probably why high intensity warmup that actually generate some lactate seem to improve performance in the actual event, the lactate ends up buffering changes in acid levels).

However, Billat's thing is getting mired in a lot of semantic crap in my opinion. The old idea of the lactate or anaerobic thresholds (as originally defined) are likely garbage. However, this doesn't negate the existence of a threshold speed or intensity above which fatigue occurs very very rapidly. That it occurs is more important practially than what you call it or what is causing it.

The simple fact is that a runner may be able to maintain (and these values are pulled out of my butt)

10mph for essentially forever
10.5 mph for an hour but it works the hell out of them
11 mph and they fatigue in a few minutes

again, values are for example only.

clearly there is a criticial threshold point above which fatigue occurs rapidly. from a practical standpoint, that's essentially what the old ideas of LT/AT/OBLA/etc. were describing.

you can graph velocity versus time to exhaustion and see that kind of pattern. below some level, the athlete can go until they get bored or run out of muscle glycogen, around some point they are working very hard but can maintain speed for extended periods (cyclists will test 20' although an hour maximum time trial isa better indicator), above that point and fatigue hits like a hammer after a few minutes.

It's actually looking like H+ production (rather than lactate per se) is the cause of this. It's also turning out (going to ccrow's point) that the aerobic engine is a much bigger determinant of this than previously thought. Mitochondria buffer acid levels and the bigger the aerobic engine, the less acid is produced.

A common trend in a lot of endurance sports is going back to volumes of low intensity aerobic work with just a bit of higher intensity stuff thrown on to top off the system (the system adapts quickly but stops adapting equally quickly, some of hte interval studies in cyclists show that 6 workouts across 3 weeks pretty uch maximizes the benefits)).

An example, there's a paper describing the training of the german track cycling team in the 1km (or was it 4k). An event last 4 minutes which most would argue is highly anaerobic. Most of their training was easy aerobic with some stage racing and a bit of specific track training thrown in at the end.

As I recall, a typical rowing race is roughly 6 minutes and even there they are going back to volumes of low intensity work to build the aerobic engine.

There's also an old idea (Maglioscho's book gets into this) that too much high intensity training can actually degrade the aerobic engine which *might* be what the US Rowing team was experiencing: if their caoches emphasized too much work around or at LT (or high intensity intervals) and lose aerobic engine size, that could actually be detrimental.

Translation of my long-winded crap: it may be better over extended periods of training to build this engine (again going to ccrow's comment) with lower intensity aerobic work. This can be topped off with higher intensity stuff as needed.

Maybe the boxer and martial artists who did extended road work weren't so wrong after all.
__________________
Practical Strength
Dave Van Skike is offline   Reply With Quote
 


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:55 AM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.6.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Subscribe to our Newsletter


Receive emails with training tips, news updates, events info, sale notifications and more.
ASK GREG

Submit your question to be answered by Greg Everett in the Performance Menu or on the website

Submit Your Question
WEIGHTLIFTING TEAM

Catalyst Athletics is a USA Weightlifting team of competitive Olympic-style weightlifters with multiple national team medals.

Read More
Olympic Weightlifting Book
Catalyst Athletics
Contact Us
About
Help
Newsletter
Products & Services
Gym
Store
Seminars
Weightlifting Team
Performance Menu
Magazine Home
Subscriber Login
Issues
Articles
Workouts
About the Program
Workout Archives
Exercise Demos
Text Only
Instructional Content
Exercise Demos
Video Gallery
Free Articles
Free Recipes
Resources
Recommended Books & DVDs
Olympic Weightlifting Guide
Discussion Forum
Weight Conversion Calculator