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Old 08-17-2008, 07:58 AM   #21
Frank Needham
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Saturday: We went out to eat and see a flick last night. Did the whole works and got the sitter workin' too. Nice to sit through a dinner and movie without making sure the boy didn't pull someone's dinner off their table.

The menu yesterday was bacon and eggs, coffee/cream for breakfast pwo. Dinner at claimjumper's was: Two pints of Sam Adams, seared ahi with greens and trimmings, one large slice of toasted bread with butter and cheese, snacked on bit of my wife's fried calamari and had a cup of vegetable soup. As near as I can figure it the cals were roughly 1500 for the entire day. And I was not that hungry either. Another benefit of IF is it teaches you that you are in control of your hunger.

the ahi salad at claimjumper's is really nice.
Here's dinner:
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Old 08-17-2008, 07:57 PM   #22
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Morning pwo meal bacon & eggs, coffee w/ cream. Dinner is pork loin, cottage cheese, artichoke hearts, beef stew and goat's milk. Today's total is 2000 cals. Feeling good about staying on track this weekend with the food and being disciplined.
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Old 08-18-2008, 12:15 PM   #23
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So, I've got some questions. I've been IFing now for several days, lost lbs down to 188 from 192 which I like, no real problem with energy. No problems dealing with hunger for the most part. I'm losing weight, sleeping well, strength is up as indicated by pretty successfully lifting more during workouts. Not doing much in the way of metcons though I did one yesterday for the first time in a while. I've read so many times in the past that people will claim it is darn near impossible to lose fat weight but build muscle and strength while doing heavy lifts, which is what seems to be happening to me. This is supposed to be especially true for those in my age bracket (I'll officially be a senior citizen in just over a year) due to hormone issues. Otoh, I read from many sources (Zone proponents for example) that you have to strip all the extra fat and then rebuild to have more muscle and get stronger. So what gives? I don't really see any controversy here but I sometimes wonder if the people who make the statements such as those outlined are just repeating things they've heard but in fact have no basis for in reality?
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Old 08-18-2008, 08:38 PM   #24
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Rest day, was tired yesterday and thought it best to sit it out till tomorrow. Plus I need to adjust my workouts to the am with fall and school starting up. Today was IF with the time lapse between meals being almost 24 hours. Coffee w/ cream, off to work, come home, go to the dentist with the family, lastly come home and eat dinner. Menu was pork loin, artichoke hearts, cottage cheese, 1 1/2 tortillas, banana, mixed nuts, goat yogurt, 7 grams fish oil. About 2000 cals total. Oh yeah, 20 minute fast bike ride on break at work. New bike is fun. Energy level is pure and high all day.
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Old 08-19-2008, 05:11 AM   #25
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I'm having a hard time reading your question? Can you break it up into min-questions or rephrase some of it?

Must have my coffee......
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Old 08-19-2008, 07:17 AM   #26
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There are many who makes statements that in my experience don't really add up. Like this one: You can't get stronger while limiting your food intake. This morning I did deads for 270, 5 reps and felt like I could go more. This is definitely an increase in strength for me and I'm not supposed to be able to according those who talk trash and say you can't do that. So, I'm asking where do they get this from? Is this just more conventional wisdom accepted without question? I'm definitely getting stronger while losing bf and gaining muscle (recomposition), not gaining mass mind you, so I believe that most of those pushing this stuff don't really know what they are talking about.

Another that is passed about frequently: You have to get lean before you can get bigger and stronger, from Zone proponents. If you are practicing strict Zone you are going to be a stick man for as long as you are on Zone no matter what movements you do. So why pass out statements like that as they are misleading/misinformed at best?

Are you drinking cold brewed? That stuff is so good I should have an IV drip to carry around with me! Forget about geezin' it.
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Old 08-19-2008, 08:12 AM   #27
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Gotcha now.

When you throw IF in there it actually might change conventional wisdom around because there are thoughts that IF helps you partition your nutrients better than an equal amount of calories on a 6 meal/day eating schedule. I know that when I IF I need less calories than I had in the past when I was doing the 6 meal/day thing.

For the most part I think it's true that a person is not going to get a lot stronger and gain a lot of lean mass if you are in a caloric deficit. It could be that 2000 kcals is not necessarily a huge caloric deficit for you. I've definitely found that those equations for calculating caloric needs are not the greatest.

How are you measuring all your progress? I know you can see your numbers in lifts go up pretty readily and you can see scale weight go down, how are you measuring bodyfat?

I'm not sure I've ever heard the thing about having to get lean before getting bigger and stronger. I guess I've never really followed the Zone stuff too closely.

Unfortunately I'm drinking the office coffee with heavy cream I bring in from home. I had actually kicked the habit for months but recently started back up with these 4,5 am workouts the last 2 months.
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Old 08-19-2008, 10:01 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Allen Yeh View Post
How are you measuring all your progress? I know you can see your numbers in lifts go up pretty readily and you can see scale weight go down, how are you measuring bodyfat?
Knowing tha scales and bf devices can lie, I'm using primarily the tape and mirror. Plus anecdotal stuff like needing to tighten the belt a notch, pants getting all bunched up around the waist under my belt (uncomfortable!). Also, even with only having gone down about 5 lbs, my pullups are ratcheting upward. Some of that has to be coz of strength/muscle gains.
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Old 08-19-2008, 05:07 PM   #29
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Switched to am workouts today, then had bacon/egg pwo with coffee/cream. Workout was great, felt pretty strong. Headed off to work feeling pretty swelled up. Along about 2:30pm my energy just drained. This doesn't seem to happen to me on days were I don't eat anything until the evening. I'm definitely going to try doing a tough workout on Thursday and then IF until I get home after work to examine the difference. Today the menu was coffee/cream, eggs/bacon, huge bowl of salad w/pesto, pork loin, cottage cheese, artichoke hearts and fish oil.
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Old 08-20-2008, 02:39 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Needham View Post
Knowing tha scales and bf devices can lie, I'm using primarily the tape and mirror. Plus anecdotal stuff like needing to tighten the belt a notch, pants getting all bunched up around the waist under my belt (uncomfortable!). Also, even with only having gone down about 5 lbs, my pullups are ratcheting upward. Some of that has to be coz of strength/muscle gains.
Sounds like progress to me.
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-Kelly Starrett
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