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Old 02-24-2010, 09:48 AM   #1
Mike Kerce
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Default Testing Maxes on Hang lifts, etc.

just a general question - do you find it beneficial to work to maxes in clean/snatch from the hang? or just from the floor? i'm making various lists of movements/lifts to help me make up my programming, and i'd like to make a list of lifts for maxes. here's what i have so far...please let me know if you feel i'm missing anything that's a must have or if you do anything additional or different that might be valuable. Thanks in advance!

Deadlift
Back Squat
Press
OHS
Clean
C&J
Snatch
Front Squat
Bench Press

outside of those, i had a couple on my old tracking log from CF that i wasn't sure if they'd be valuable now...namely Push Jerk, Push Press, Thruster
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Old 02-24-2010, 01:41 PM   #2
Geoffrey Thompson
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In my uneducated opinion, I would just think of them based on the full lifts. I wouldn't think about maxing out on them, but the max would probably be a few kilos less than the full lift. I don't think it's that worthwhile to think of them as a separate lift. (ie, you may program them, but just program as % of full lift)

Push presses are pretty valuable. Push jerk, maybe useful. But Hitler hates thrusters.

If your max clean and max jerk differ significantly and you practice them separately sometimes, you might want to track both separately along with the full competition lift. (ie, you have Clean and C&J, might want to track Jerk, too)
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Old 02-24-2010, 03:31 PM   #3
Pete Gordon
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mike do you mean you'll be using


Deadlift
Back Squat
Press
OHS
Clean
C&J
Snatch
Front Squat
Bench Press

in a training program you're putting together? I"ve not seen the Bp or DL in a weightlifting program before. Why did you select them?
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Old 02-24-2010, 07:09 PM   #4
Mike Kerce
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoffrey Thompson View Post
In my uneducated opinion, I would just think of them based on the full lifts. I wouldn't think about maxing out on them, but the max would probably be a few kilos less than the full lift. I don't think it's that worthwhile to think of them as a separate lift. (ie, you may program them, but just program as % of full lift)

Push presses are pretty valuable. Push jerk, maybe useful. But Hitler hates thrusters.

If your max clean and max jerk differ significantly and you practice them separately sometimes, you might want to track both separately along with the full competition lift. (ie, you have Clean and C&J, might want to track Jerk, too)
thank you...that makes alot of sense. i'll ditch the thrusters and the hang cleans/snatches (just as max lifts/will use for training) and keep the rest.
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Old 02-24-2010, 07:12 PM   #5
Mike Kerce
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete Gordon View Post
mike do you mean you'll be using


Deadlift
Back Squat
Press
OHS
Clean
C&J
Snatch
Front Squat
Bench Press

in a training program you're putting together? I"ve not seen the Bp or DL in a weightlifting program before. Why did you select them?
Pete - it's not really specifically a weightlifting program. I'm doing Wendler 5/3/1 on a 3x/week basis and one of my 2 other training days will be a MEBB style workout with a max effort lift followed by a short metcon. I won't technically be using DL/BS/BP/SP for max effort except about once every quarter.
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Old 02-24-2010, 08:52 PM   #6
Pete Gordon
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Oh i see now. That's a real nice 5 day split you're thinking of


What are you planning on doing for met con ?
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Old 02-25-2010, 04:31 AM   #7
Allen Yeh
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You are doing 5/3/1 3 times a week and then once a week you are doing MEBB? with one of the exercises listed above?

I'd recommend just doing 5/3/1 as recommended if you only want to do it 3x a week then do something else on the 2 other days but I wouldn't recommend MEBB. If you really want to hit the barbells on your non 5/3/1 days maybe barbell complexes or an Oly day or something along those lines.

Wendler said in his manual if you want to include PC's you can throw them in before DL's. That is what I have done in the past when I want to include cleans/snatches is to throw them in on the squat/dl days.
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Old 02-25-2010, 05:15 AM   #8
Mike Kerce
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thanks, Allen - i'm still trying to get it all worked out. i guess i don't specifically need to do MEBB style, just want to at least get in some cleans each week (it's a weak lift for me) so maybe i'll either work them in on DL day or do a complex like you said...i know a couple of the Dan John Complexes have cleans in them, along with a few other things i need work on, so perhaps i will try one of them. i need to keep some kind of metcon in there though cause i'm fat and out of shape. my thoughts were to do metcon twice a week on my non-W531 days...i picked out a big bunch from CFFB, MEBB and some kettlebell stuff. so my week would look something like:

M - W531
Tu - light DJ Complex or OLY skills work, Metcon (short)
W - W531
Th - Off
F - W531
Sa - CFFB or some type of KB Complex
Su - Off

what do you think? still too much?
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Old 02-25-2010, 07:22 AM   #9
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In his manual there is a section called North of Vag and it calls for you to do conditioning on your lift days anyway. He recommended prowler or hill sprints. If you have no access to either i'd try to do some type short(5-10 minutes max) of non dumb conditioning.

basic north of vag temp:
foam roll/stretch
jump rope
lifts
conditioning

I'd just throw in the cleans on the DL day and do complexes also at the end for conditioning. If you want to lose weight as well then start walking. 3+ times a week 30-45 minute walks. On top of your lifts. I started doing NEPA walks when I did the Velocity Diet (NEPA walks = fancy term for something above a stroll but below a jog) and since then when i've wanted to lose some extra heft I've cleaned up my eating and added the walks back in.

If you are just itching to workout on non lift days, do your warmup some KB or skill stuff then your walk. If you are out of shape you don't want to get too crazy too fast.
day, for example:

1 - 5/3/1 + barbell complexes
2 - NEPA walk
3 - 5/3/1 + cleans +KB complexes
4 - NEPA walk
5 - 5/3/1 + sprints/hill sprints
6 - NEPA walk
7 - NEPA walk
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Old 02-25-2010, 07:47 AM   #10
Mike Kerce
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thanks again, Allen. I really like the way you have it set out there. when i say out of shape i mean in relative terms...i've been doing CrossFit at an affiliate for about 8 months, so i'm relatively able to do most things required, but, at 265, i still can't really run much and i don't have much in the endurance department. I was trying to build on my running on 5/3/1 days but 5/3/1 has taken a bit more of a toll than i expected and running beats up my hips and back so it's not a great combo.
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