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Old 01-04-2011, 02:58 PM   #11
Jane Michel
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Quote:
Off days: eat ~2300 calories, high protein, low carb, remainder fat. Martin recommends making the first meal the biggest; I do the last meal biggest so I can eat normally with the family.

On days: eat 2800-3000 calories. Since I train in the evening, first meal is about 300 calories very high protein, second meal is about 3-400 calories, with some fruit, after training meal is big :-), meat and root vegetables for me, mostly.
Have you experimented with not eating for 11+ hours after training? If so, how did that work for you?

I'm curious because I've bastardised the protocol by training at 7am and usually eating the first meal only 11+ hours later, and am wondering how much this affects recovery, muscle gain, and fat loss.

Quote:
Sweet Potatoes are allowed then?
You could try doing it with and without sweet potatoes to see how they affect the dropping of your last few pounds.
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Old 01-04-2011, 03:15 PM   #12
Derek Weaver
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Originally Posted by Charlie Vassallo View Post
Do you follow Paleo or you just eat clean?

Sweet Potatoes are allowed then?
Sweet Potatoes are fine. It's hard to hit your necessary carbohydrate numbers if you're eating strict Paleo. I would no longer recommend a strict Paleo diet if you have a high activity level, like yourself.

Alicia,
Martin has had a post or two about training in the morning. he has some BCAA recommendations and has noted that his clients have done well following his guidelines. I've followed this myself at times and have felt good so long as I stay hydrated and caffeinated. Others may not deal with the caffeine as well, especially in a fasted state.

His site is much easier to navigate now and has all the information on this pretty accessible.
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Old 01-04-2011, 08:53 PM   #13
Charlie Vassallo
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I need to read up on the fasted training especially in the am if I go for my run. I want to look into taking some BCAAS and according to Martin he goes with Purple Wraath.

As for sweet potatoes, I guess I'll have to experiment and go from there. And yes, I agree, its a ton of veggies/fruit to get the carb intake needed for high intensity workouts.

Today for example.

Morning Run - 35 minutes
Run to CF - 15 minutes
5/3/1 program plus CF WOD
Run home - 15 minutes

So I have to eat a ton but not over due it.
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Old 01-04-2011, 09:31 PM   #14
Jane Michel
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Originally Posted by Derek Weaver View Post
Martin has had a post or two about training in the morning. he has some BCAA recommendations and has noted that his clients have done well following his guidelines. I've followed this myself at times and have felt good so long as I stay hydrated and caffeinated. Others may not deal with the caffeine as well, especially in a fasted state.
Hi Derek, are there posts about breaking the fast only 11+ hours after training? I have read his protocols but might've missed something if you say there are posts about this.

And BCAAs - yeah I just started experimenting with it last month and have found it excellent in helping control cortisol.



Charlie - sounds like you're doing heaps of work..................... how long have you been doing this?
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Old 01-04-2011, 11:47 PM   #15
Derek Weaver
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Alicia,
I don't remember seeing anything in the 11-12 hour range for breaking the fast, but you can more or less figure out where to go and how from the information he's got up there.

I'm a little perplexed how you're going 11+ hours from training to eating though. Are you working out at 6 am or earlier, then eating at 5 pm or later?

Either way going off of the sample from Martin's Website
Quote:
Early morning fasted training

Here's a sample setup for a client that trains early in the morning and prefers the feeding phase at noon or later.

6 AM: 5-15 minutes pre-workout: 10 g BCAA.
6-7 AM: Training.
8 AM: 10 g BCAA.
10 AM: 10 g BCAA
12-1 PM: The "real" post-workout meal (largest meal of the day). Start of the 8 hour feeding-window.
8-9 PM: Last meal before the fast.

... Simply mix 30 g of BCAA powder in a shake and drink one third of it every other hour starting 5-15 minutes pre-workout....
If you were to follow that same every other hour schedule, you'd be at or around 50 grams of BCAA on training days. Pretty extreme, and would likely call for tabs due to cost.

I would email Martin to see his take on it.
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Old 01-05-2011, 03:05 AM   #16
Jane Michel
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Derek I've seen Martin's protocols and know that what I'm doing is quite different, which is why I said I am doing a bastardised version of it.

What I was asking is whether anyone has experimented with following his protocols for a period of time, and also not following them for a period of time by continuing to fast 11+ hours after training, and what difference between the two in terms of effects on recovery, muscle gain and fat loss were noticed.
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Old 01-05-2011, 03:18 PM   #17
Charlie Vassallo
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Originally Posted by Alicia Zhuang View Post
Hi Derek, are there posts about breaking the fast only 11+ hours after training? I have read his protocols but might've missed something if you say there are posts about this.

And BCAAs - yeah I just started experimenting with it last month and have found it excellent in helping control cortisol.



Charlie - sounds like you're doing heaps of work..................... how long have you been doing this?
I just started IF this week. Feels good thus far.

As for my workload, since the training for some 30kms started, I'm doing that routine 3x a week.

Today was.

5/3/1
Strength Work
CF WOD

No run - off day for run.

Tomorrow

15 minute run to gym
5/31
Strength Work
Snatch Work
15 HIIT on rower
15 minute run home
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Old 01-08-2011, 07:26 AM   #18
Jane Michel
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Keep posting how you're going with it Charlie. I usually get into an overtrained state after about 2-3 weeks of CF WODs and will be interested to see whether your schedule plus IF is sustainable.
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Old 01-09-2011, 07:51 AM   #19
Charlie Vassallo
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Originally Posted by Alicia Zhuang View Post
Keep posting how you're going with it Charlie. I usually get into an overtrained state after about 2-3 weeks of CF WODs and will be interested to see whether your schedule plus IF is sustainable.
So far so good.

I've put in three runs this week on top of my 5/3/1-Strength work. Two days I did the CF WOD because it was relatively short/intense one and felt good.

Saturday I just did the WOD - which involved running.

Sunday I just went for an hour run.

So far so good.

Not sure I'm losing weight yet though.

But I feel good.
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Old 01-09-2011, 02:40 PM   #20
Jane Michel
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Sounds good then

Were there any changes made to your schedule? And did you add in the BCAAs?
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