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Old 04-20-2007, 07:47 AM   #11
James Evans
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Originally Posted by Allen Yeh View Post
I currently don't wear any inserts in any of my shoes any more. I kind of didn't like the thought that I was just fixing the immediate problem of overpronation without addressing the "how I ran" problem.

I will go to a running store to get checked out though.

Does your girlfriend run in her Free's all the time?
Yes she does. I think she has run marathons and triathlons in them.

She's a physio and she knows best....I bow to her opinion.
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Old 04-20-2007, 07:58 AM   #12
James Evans
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What areas do run in James? I'm lucky as I'm in leafy SE London!
I live in Wimbledon at the foot of the hill that leads up to Wimbledon Common. Stiff climb and I'm on the Common in between 7 and 15 minutes depending which way I go. Then a further 3 miles on to Richmond Park.

Loads of quiet backstreets with challenging hills and I run them a lot at night. Do a lot of running on the Common and I run with my girlfriend in Richmond Park, Bushy Park, Windsor Great Park and along the Thames near Twickenham & Richmond (some of those involve car journeys).

I work in the City by Liverpool Street and run back to Waterloo about 4 evenings a week. Sometimes I stretch this out as far as Vauxhall or even Battersea Park to use the pull up and dip bars (although apparently only munchkins are aloud to do chins in London these days as all the bars have been dropped in height). I can do my work to Waterloo with a rucksack in 18 minutes which beats the Tube in the summer.
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Old 04-20-2007, 09:20 AM   #13
Derek Simonds
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Great info James. I am beginning my build for an olympic distance triathlon in September.

For me running distance isn't overly taxing on my aerobic system it is hell on my tendons and ligaments. I have to build up to longer distances if I don't want to be in pain the day after the run. I ran 4 miles with my sister last weekend and it took 4 days to recover.

Allen the best advice I can give you is to go to a running store and have them help you with fitting. Doing that changed my comfort level completely. If they know what they are doing they will check you for over / under pronation and reccomend a shoe accordingly.

I weigh right at 190 and I agree with James whatever you do for training I would stay away from a light weight trainer or racing flat. My personal favorite is the asics cirrus gel. It is a nuetral shoe with good cushioning. I have 3 pairs. the other goofy thing is that I use these laces that are like bungy cords and I just slip my feet in and it adjusts the pressure accordingly. I think they are called lace locks. With laces I get hot spots on longer runs.
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Old 04-20-2007, 09:29 AM   #14
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One thing I forgot to mention, when factoring in weights work is that motherf@cking squats day doesn't go.
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Old 04-20-2007, 09:36 AM   #15
James Evans
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Derek,

I've raced off the back of my programme from 5km road through to 10 miles off road (www.hellrunner.co.uk/).

It's good for getting you ready to prepare for racing if you follow my drift. I think we can get Allen to his goal without much effort but I would tinker and refine for race training.

I would also run more shorter time trials and races just to get used to running with others.

Some of the iron boys may laugh but I'd recommend short races if anything just be used to how rough it can get out there at the start, all those pointy knees and elbows coming at you from the skinny little mothers.
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Old 04-20-2007, 09:49 AM   #16
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Thanks a lot for all the contributions and information. I appreciate it.

In regards to the shoe thing, for right now I'm going to try to stick with my Free's and see how that treats me, if I start feeling it too much I will consider getting some other shoes at that point. I just don't want to rush into buying a pair because I know to get a decent pair it's around $100 (the last Asics I got were $110).

If I run 3 times a week, 2-3 other workouts per week also? perhaps 2 metcons and 1 day of mostly prehab/mobility type stuff? I guess I need to start running and see how the other stuff falls in since recovery for me has always been an issue.
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Old 04-20-2007, 09:58 AM   #17
James Evans
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In regards to the shoe thing, for right now I'm going to try to stick with my Free's and see how that treats me, if I start feeling it too much I will consider getting some other shoes at that point. I just don't want to rush into buying a pair because I know to get a decent pair it's around $100 (the last Asics I got were $110).
$100! They set me back close to 100. $2 to 1 at the mo...

Have a go at 3 runs, 2 metcon type workouts and some recovery/prehab/rehab stuff. Maybe one metcon, one strength session. Strength doesn't have to be balls to the wall ME does it? Will you be subject to strength tests like push ups and pull ups? I guess pull ups are more a Navy/Marine thing.
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Old 04-20-2007, 10:07 AM   #18
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Not sure that anyone agreed with me on the other thread so I'll pose this as a question for James/running people et al...

Do you think there is benefit for those starting out with a sharp jump in their running goal (like Allen going from sprints and what not to a solid 5 miles tempo runs) to concentrating on fixing form issues at the start?

I am not a runner. I have not "run" for "running" sake for about 15 years. I have done a good deal of experience training in other endurance events.

If someone came to me and asked "how to I train for a 1 hour criterium or a 10k time trial?" The first thing I would do is check their position and understand their natural cadence to correct form issues.

In my mind Cycling requires far less kinesthetic awareness than running but form is still hyper critical for efficient fast cycling. It's not that you can't gut it out..... but being able to hammer without good form leaves you mid pack at best.

Now I know that this is the case in cycling but am I way off base when it comes to running? Do form, cadence and gate not really make that big a difference?
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Old 04-20-2007, 10:20 AM   #19
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Now I know that this is the case in cycling but am I way off base when it comes to running? Do form, cadence and gate not really make that big a difference?
I'm pretty sure on the other thread I agreed with you that form is huge. It made a huge difference for me by adjusting the way I ran it didn't magically make it easier or anything but the results of barely ever getting shin splints spoke volumes to me. It used to be that I just thought I was just going to get shin splints no matter how much I ran. Now I know differently.
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Old 04-20-2007, 10:34 AM   #20
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I think it depends on the individual. Lots of people have fairly good technique naturally (especially if they are not overweight). I think concentrating on relaxing, been up on your toes and falling forward are worthwhile. I'm not sure you need to put tons of work into this though - it's really just running how your body is designed to after all. Like I said I think the whole thing goes out the window if you're wearing boots and carrying weights.

Dave I wonder whether technical improvements cause greater efficiency in running or cycling? My instinct is that getting as close to a perfect circle in your cycling stroke will cause a massive increase in speed - however I don't cycle so this may be rubbish.

So I think POSE/CHI/running well are valuable if used in conjunction with running training. I don't think it's enough (in Allen's case) on it's own. And like I said add webbing, pack, rifle and a helmet and try to run POSE and it's just not happening for the majority of people.
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