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Old 03-13-2008, 04:49 AM   #21
Allen Yeh
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Originally Posted by Tracy Kay View Post
I am very new to IF, this is my third day, and I have been using a 19 hour fast with a five hour eating window. So far I have eaten at least twice in every window and have not felt stuffed or hungry and have not experienced unbearable hunger pains - really just a consiousness that I am hungry and haven't eaten yet for the day. I am not counting calories or grams of protien - I am eating primarily lean meats, tuna and vegetables, salads (have had a few a couple of oatmeal raisin nut cookies). So far no issues.

Based on what folks are saying above, you all do different lengths of fasting. What is the the range? Do you do it every day, M-F, eod, etc. I think I am going to be able to do this daily, since as I already said I have no issues - but maybe I am in the honeymoon phase?

At first I did it very strictly 7 days a week, 18-20 hours fasts per day but I found that it seemed that my metabolism had slowed a bit(a couple of signs, lower body temperature when I'd wake up, feeling cold all the time...etc) and made my IF even more intermittent by throwing in a few days of normal eating hours.

In regards to the measuring thing, unless you pretty much can eyeball stuff and know that you are getting enough calories, I still find there to be value in measuring. I will respond more in depth on your question over in the other thread.
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Old 03-13-2008, 09:26 AM   #22
Garrett Smith
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I've definitely found the intermittency part valuable in making IF convenient for me. Here's a loose plan of how my IF week goes (at the moment):

Wednesday: I have a business networking lunch, so I always eat around 12:30pm, then I have adult gymnastics that night and follow that with dinner around 9pm, going to bed around 10pm.

Saturday and Sunday: Usually a big brunch/lunch around 10am-Noon, followed by a big dinner anywhere from 5-7pm.

The other weekdays are either ~15 hour fasts (eating lunch and dinner) or ~22 hour fasts (only dinner). I choose one or the other based on how I feel, how much I've been eating in general (more food over the weekend means more long fasts during the week), and my own convenience (ie. if I forget to bring lunch to the office, it's a long fast day!).

I have not lost any muscle. I am putting up PRs in my major lifts and gymnastics drills regularly. I don't ever feel stuffed unless I eat too much (I have my gorging tendencies), and I know when that is happening, sometimes I choose not to stop myself (dumb!).

It's the intermittency "options" of IF that make it convenient. It is exactly the fact that people are trying to make IF a specific pattern that they are finding it inconvenient.

There should be times of overfeeding, with underfeeding being a consistent/majority part. I'd guess that my current plan is accomplishing that pretty well, FWIW.
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Old 03-13-2008, 01:37 PM   #23
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Garrett I can totally relate to how you describe your gorging tendencies. This has been a bit of a struggle for me too, but I think one of the "last steps" to getting this whole paleo/IF thing. Particular the way devany's EF model is described. Notice how he has repeatedly emphasized gorgeing goes against the tenets of the EF way.

What I've had to do (which I was so hesistant to do based on how I felt it was not in line with a paleo experience) is break my meals down to relatively small portions. A really big meal, paleo or not, is gonna leave you with the "gorge" feeling -> mainly lethargy. I suspect that the glycemic content of food is not the only factor in insulin control. Devany has alluded to this I think. [the recent research on artificial sweeteners also seems relevant]

Just this last week I've been (still in the context of partial IF) splitting a typical meal size into 2 parts, trying to eat until just before that full feeling. Even if I only wait an hour before having a bit more it makes all the difference. I think it falls into place when you finally let go of that last inkling of BB mentality telling you to concern yourself with how many calories to get in.

Energy levels seem to be riding high more consistently. And that is the most significant reason I am so interested in paleo/IF in the first place.

The way I see things is this: there is a "missing gap" between the evolutionary logic of seasonality, seasonal variations in insulin sensitivity. It just doesn't fit our modern lifestyles to adopt gorge eating habits. A hunter gather likely does gorge to extremes when food is plentiful, and lies around doing nothing after such meals. That is how their seasons rotate between high and low insulin sensitivity. But the EF model is much more elegant than that. One could even argue that it is "transhumanist" in the sense that it deviates significantly from our "natural" lifestyle but manipulates our genes to enhance our hormone profiles to our needs.
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Old 03-13-2008, 01:55 PM   #24
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Nice post, Greg.

I think I might have made it sound like I gorge a lot more often than I do. Actually it is rare (especially with only meat and veg), and the times I feel the worst is when I deviate from the Paleo prescription (or have too many Paleo carbs with meat).

I'm going to start another thread on this today or tomorrow, but one thing I think no one is looking at is how non-Paleo carrying around giant containers of purified water is to sip at all day. I'll post more on this in another thread.
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Old 03-13-2008, 02:14 PM   #25
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Also you can say that Paleo's man priority eat as much as he could in the summer....to make it through the winter (less foods available...burn more bodyfat to survive). Less fasting in the summer....more periods of fasting in the winter. That and activity level is higher in the summer...less in the winter? Plus I don't think he cared about walking around at 8% BF all day long to survive and flex at paleo women.
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Old 03-13-2008, 02:29 PM   #26
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MOD,
Wasn't the only motivation for Paleo man the Paleo women???
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Old 03-13-2008, 02:41 PM   #27
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Has anyone seen any data on BF% of paleolithic men and women? I've seen a lot of speculations, some of them quite romantic, but I don't know if a plausible estimate can be made from human remains.
I'm especially curious about the effect of seasonally varying BF% on women's menstrual cycles. One camp says women experienced few "periods" because they were more or less constantly pregnant and/or lactating during their fertile years. Another says that they were not even fertile year round as their BF% dipped low. I certainly don't buy that a woman has to have a monthly cycle or she is not healthy. Again, could not find any "data" on this.
Sorry if it's a bit of a hijack...
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Old 03-13-2008, 02:57 PM   #28
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I don't think there is anyway way to know, really. Contemporary male H/G's are usually quite lean (below 10%) and muscular. The females are typically quite curvy and have higher body fat levels around 20% or so.

Not sure about the menstrual cycle though.
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Old 03-13-2008, 03:21 PM   #29
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The females are typically quite curvy and have higher body fat levels around 20% or so.
If you think about it, we women got a bum deal... Lofty athletic goals are just not in line with the Paleo ideal. I know I'm set on the former at this point, but I wonder what the price may be.
Yeah! I'll take six pack abs and back flips. Take that, Evolution!
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Old 03-13-2008, 05:10 PM   #30
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MOD,
Wasn't the only motivation for Paleo man the Paleo women???
Yeah but back then they just looked for the biggest cave and nicest wheel.....oh wait...things haven't changed.
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