Black boxing sleep supplements

[Mike ODonnell]

Originally Posted by Gittit Shwartz

I'm usually "wired but tired" at night and have a hard time getting to sleep.

Like Dr G says.....cortisol is too high....ergo giving you the "wired" feeling (as cortisol regulates blood sugar and increases it in times of stress/fight or flight)

You need to as I say "dumb down" at night. Look at your lifestyle and take out anything that may be promoting the whole "fight or flight" stimulus such as TV (esp when you talk about exciting shows or scary ones), Computer time, too much going on in general, stressing out about the next day....etc. Just wind down and keep the lights low (light is a stimulus), otherwise you rebound into that wired stage (for me it's about 10pm....once I start getting back wired past 10 then I could easily stay up till 2.....so I know I need to shut things down starting around 9).

Never really tested it but have heard cinnamon as being a good thing to have an hour before bed as it is a glucose shuttling agent....so will help the blood sugar to come down.

[Gittit Shwartz]

Thanks Dr. G and MOD for your advice and concern. I should be getting my ASI results within the next couple of days and will definitely get in touch ASAP to discuss them. (ASI for those who haven't heard of it stands for Adrenal Stress Index - tests for saliva cortisol and DHEA levels at 4 points during the day.)

[Greg Battaglia]

Thanks for all of the interesting feedback. Just to set the record straight (if it even needed to be in the first place) I don't think sleep supplements are necessary for proper, healthy sleep. In a pristine world sleep would come easy. It's just that at this point in my life my schedule is too erratic for me to get to bed at the same time for the same amount of time every night, which inevitably will mess with my circadian rhythm. Hence, I use some sleep aids to help get the sleep ball rolling.

Anyway, I've been sticking with the ZMA and haven't used any of the others since my original post. My sleep quality has been excellent, I just really need to work on getting to bed at the same time every night. I think consistency is important.

MOD,
I notice the same thing. About an hour after dinner I begin to feel really sleepy, which will last for about 30 mins before it fades and then I actually get really wired and revved up. Once I reach this point I feel like I'm prepared to do met-cons galore 'til 3:00 AM.

[Garrett Smith]

Greg, no need to justify using something to help you sleep in today's world. I wish I didn't feel the need to use them either, but I'd rather sleep than worry about pride/ego preventing me from helping myself...

[Mike ODonnell]

Wine and Family Guy before bed....works like a charm 100% of the time.

[Paul McKirdy]

+1 to the post feast carb induced coma . Whether it be a glass of wine or a huge bowl of all natural cherry vanilla iceam mmmm ice cream or both ...

All sustinence intake is a chemical stimulant to some angle of deflection from balance, apply as necessary .

[Allen Yeh]

-1 for carb induced coma

The last few weeks after eating a heavy carb meal as my last one prior to bed I've been finding it very hard to go to sleep.

[Grant Anderson]

In regards to melatonin as a sleep supplement, from what I've researched/read, most people are essentially overdosing (for lack of a better word) with melatonin. I don't mean really overdosing, as in dangerously, but from all the studies I've read, you only need low doses to feel the effects of melatonin. One study found significant improvement with doses ranging from .3 to 1mg. (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7...?dopt=Abstract) (w/f/s)

I've read another article (which I can't find right now unfortunately) which suggested that larger doses of melatonin could build up resistance to its effects.

I've found ZMA to be helpful for more restful sleep, but it doesn't seem to help much with getting to sleep.

As for comments about trying L-tyrosine for sleep, I've used that for alertness, so using it for sleep seems rather counterproductive. As fas as I know, it helps brain function (vague, I know) and CNS activity, something I wouldn't associate with sleeping.

From my own personal experience, I've found that a big meal somewhat high in carbs before bed gets me to sleep pretty fast, as does a casein shake.

[Garrett Smith]

The new remedy from Guna that I've been using to help with my sleep actually has homeopathic doses of melatonin in it. I've been sleeping like a baby these days. If I actually take some of the Pharma-GABA now, I don't wake up all night and arise in the same position I went to bed in! That didn't use to happen...

[Ivan Wolfe]

FWIW, here's what works for me (I've black boxed all of these at various times):

GABA - works great. Only thing that really works at all. However, I find I need increasing doses over time if I don't take a week off once every couple of months.

Valerian - causes my brain to go wonky. I'm not sure how else to describe it - whenever I use it, I can't concentrate, my brain seems to begin firing randomly, and I feel like a zombie (mmmm .... brains!)

Kava Kava - gives me a headache.

Hops, Chamomile - nothing.

ZMA - nothing.

Melatonin -1 mg or less helps a little. Anything over that, though, causes my dreams to be so vivid that I wake up unable to distinguish between reality and dreaming. That's too freaky for me, so I stay to 1 mg or less, and that seems to work allright.

5-HTP & L-Tryptophan: Nothing.