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Old 07-28-2008, 12:07 AM   #1
Trygve Lunde
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Default IF+Paleo low carb for professional athlete

Hello

First off i just want to say that i really love this forum and i really believe that IF and Paleo low carb is the way.

Im 22 years old and a professional soccer player, i also do weight lifting 2-3 times a week. im 180 cm, 84 kg and around 14 % BF. Ive bin following the Paleo low carb for some months now. During this time ive been trying different approches when it comes to calories and nutrition setup ( fat, protein and carb). My goal is to loose weight as in bodyfat % and to look better. I want to get under 10 at least so that i can run even longer and faster when i play soccer. As i said, my goal is fat loss and not loose the muscles i have now. I dont want to be any big body builder because i want gain anything on the soccer field. I want to have a body like brad pitt in Troja or some guys from the movie 300. Just so you get a picture what im aiming for. During this period its also important that my performance dont drop to much ( causing to low calories). Ive been trying 1600-1800 calories for some time, splitting in 100g fat, 120g protein and 40g carb. My energi level and everything has been really poor. Its like my legs dont want to stand up and walk, maybe thats because of the low carb im not sure. But im really hoping for much help regarding my food and my training. So my questions are

I train Mondag - Friday at 10:00 in the morning. The sessions is for 1-2 hours. Saturday is a day off, and Sunday is match day.

So i think my eating pattern should be. Eating starts after the soccer sessions, so around 12-1 a clock? and stops 8-9 a clock? ive been doing this for 3 days now. i have now problem woring out on empty stomach. Monday, Wednestay and Friday i do weight lifting sessions. Ive been doing different routines. But the question is, what is the best routine for me when you now my goals. Fat loss, better soccer player and of course look better.
In terms of exersices, reps and sets.

Also how should my eating window looke like in calories and how much from fat,protein and carb? what about PWO ? is it better to wait for an hour and then just eat a fat,protein and carb meal? or is the best to have a protein+carb shake right after training? of course i find it much better to eat real food since it taste a lot better, but its the goal that matters. So what do you think is the best?

When it comes to the meals, isnt it best to always start to eat the fat first? Not eating it all up, but lets say you have nuts, carrots and chicken for lunsj. Its best to start with some nuts and then mix it up as you like? since the main goal for Paleo low carb is to keep the insulin under control and fat doesnt do anything about it. Or doesnt it matter?

So how much should i be eating in calories and how much from fat, carb and protein. As you know soccer is a glycogen sport so i cant do to much carb, but i want fat as my main fuel since i know thats the way too go.

About fruit, ive heared that fructose isnt good at all. And from experience eating apples i feel kind of sick after eating one. I dont know why this is, i think apple tastes lovely but i think my stomach doesnt like it.

Should i have a carb day everey week? or a carb meal?

On sundays my match is at 6 a clock. So how should my eating pattern look like on this day to perform my best?

I think what was that, if ive forgotten something im going to add it here or in my replies
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Old 07-28-2008, 07:30 AM   #2
Mike ODonnell
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Keep it simple:

- Start slow (couple times a week or large eating window) if you want to IF weekdays....as you will need to eat to recovery properly
- Cycle your carbs (whole food) to replenish either after weight training or the day before a game
- Don't sweat the ratios...eat enough protein, fill in the fats and carbs around it. If you are not losing weight, eat less.
- You will not bulk up....I really wouldn't worry about that as you would need to eat a ton

Like any strategy....start with something....see what happens....make notes on what does work....what doesn't work.....there are always plenty of variables (esp total calories & macronutrient ratios) to change up and play with....the successful people are just the ones who can listen to their body, track results and understand when they need to change things up for better results.
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Old 07-28-2008, 04:39 PM   #3
Trygve Lunde
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ok thanx. You dont have any like rules for how much protein pr kg body weight etc. i should eat, and how much % fat should be of total calories so i will have the fat as fuel?

How about weight training sessions? how should i train in terms of reps, sets and exersices?
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Old 07-28-2008, 06:20 PM   #4
Steven Low
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Weight training should be based on both prehab and depending on what attributes you need increased for your sport... there's no right or wrong answer because it depends on your situation.

As for diet, I'll let MOD handle that.
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Old 07-28-2008, 07:33 PM   #5
Dave Van Skike
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The answer....

42. It's always 42.
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Old 07-28-2008, 07:47 PM   #6
Mike ODonnell
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trygve Lunde View Post
ok thanx. You dont have any like rules for how much protein pr kg body weight etc. i should eat, and how much % fat should be of total calories so i will have the fat as fuel?

How about weight training sessions? how should i train in terms of reps, sets and exersices?
Sure I know all that....and the ebook will be available soon.

When in doubt...reps 1-3 build power.....reps of 5 builds strength.....sets of reps 10+ will build more size/hypertrophy....of course it can get more complicated than that. Start with 5x5s if you want strength....has worked for a long time.

Fat? As much as you need to maintain performance and still lose fat. Protein...could be 0.6-1g/lb of lean muscle. Carbs...all depends on how much you are depleting your muscles with workouts. Rule of thumb....if you up the carbs pwo, lower (or don't have any) fat.....if you up the fat, lower the carbs....protein should be pretty stable.
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Old 07-28-2008, 11:21 PM   #7
Trygve Lunde
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Thanx
Ive also posted on the crossfit forum and they told me that it wasnt possible to eat Paleo low carb style. They said i need to eat zone type of diet. And with zone i use carb as fuel for the brain? after reading all the books about fat as fuel for the brain etc. and everything about the insulin etc etc. i thaught that was the way to go ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike ODonnell View Post
Sure I know all that....and the ebook will be available soon.

When in doubt...reps 1-3 build power.....reps of 5 builds strength.....sets of reps 10+ will build more size/hypertrophy....of course it can get more complicated than that. Start with 5x5s if you want strength....has worked for a long time.

Fat? As much as you need to maintain performance and still lose fat. Protein...could be 0.6-1g/lb of lean muscle. Carbs...all depends on how much you are depleting your muscles with workouts. Rule of thumb....if you up the carbs pwo, lower (or don't have any) fat.....if you up the fat, lower the carbs....protein should be pretty stable.
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Old 07-29-2008, 12:24 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trygve Lunde View Post
Thanx
Ive also posted on the crossfit forum and they told me that it wasnt possible to eat Paleo low carb style. They said i need to eat zone type of diet. And with zone i use carb as fuel for the brain? after reading all the books about fat as fuel for the brain etc. and everything about the insulin etc etc. i thaught that was the way to go ?
Ugh. Fundamental misunderstanding of how the body works.

People recommend Zone because it encourages stability in caloric intake, and it is focused on insulin control. These are good things. But not be all end alls especially since people require different percentages of macros for their bodies to work optimally.

In any case, the brain ONLY uses glucose for fuel. However, not necessarily glucose from diet (e.g. lack of sugars in diet is good b/c of insulin control). If your diet is primarily composed of FAT the liver can break down lipids and metabolize them into glucose for the brain. You don't NEED to have carbs in your diet. You do need some essential amino acids and fats though.

Basically, since you're new don't worry about any of this stuff right now. Focus on getting your diet optimized for you; if it's paleo-IF great. Hopefully it will work well. If it doesn't, it can be modified to something that does. If you want to learn about more physiology later, that's great but look in a physiology textbook or an encyclopedia (wikipedia is getting better as it's sourced for most physiology now) so that works as well.

Good luck.
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Old 07-29-2008, 02:56 AM   #9
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Steve;

Good reply. I've clipped, pasted and saved for future reference.
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Old 07-29-2008, 03:50 AM   #10
Trygve Lunde
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I understand. But the thing is, my work as a soccer player requires carb since the intensity is higher then 75% av Maximum heart rate. And that means the muscles can only use glycogen as fuel. But for for the rest i have reason to believe that fat is the right fuel for the body and that the first people ate that as there food. So i think its the most suted for the body to work best. So the question is how can i do this? use fat as fuel and get enough carb so my performance on the soccer field will be great? do u you have any advice? regarding % from each carb, fat and protein. protein is ok since its around 1g/lb


Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Low View Post
Ugh. Fundamental misunderstanding of how the body works.

People recommend Zone because it encourages stability in caloric intake, and it is focused on insulin control. These are good things. But not be all end alls especially since people require different percentages of macros for their bodies to work optimally.

In any case, the brain ONLY uses glucose for fuel. However, not necessarily glucose from diet (e.g. lack of sugars in diet is good b/c of insulin control). If your diet is primarily composed of FAT the liver can break down lipids and metabolize them into glucose for the brain. You don't NEED to have carbs in your diet. You do need some essential amino acids and fats though.

Basically, since you're new don't worry about any of this stuff right now. Focus on getting your diet optimized for you; if it's paleo-IF great. Hopefully it will work well. If it doesn't, it can be modified to something that does. If you want to learn about more physiology later, that's great but look in a physiology textbook or an encyclopedia (wikipedia is getting better as it's sourced for most physiology now) so that works as well.

Good luck.
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