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Old 08-19-2008, 10:27 AM   #11
Dave Van Skike
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I know a bunch of folks using westide that are drug free... the basic template can work really well for a lot of people. In fact west side for skinny bastards is a very good template for all around strength and power.

Also, there are a TON of masters athletes out there that need extra days of recovery and at the same time need to fit a training schedule into a normal workweek. For those folks, upper/lower splits for strongman and powerlifting are the only way to fit in the requisite intensity and allow full recovery. Myself, I go back and forth between high volume full body and medium volume upper/lower splits. For me full body high volume is base, the upper lower split is where I make big progress. It really allows intense workloads and good recovery...and AFAIK, I'm drug free.
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Old 08-19-2008, 10:49 AM   #12
Anthony Bainbridge
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My paragraph about westside was not a knock on their methods - they obviously work. But I think WAY too many people ask "what are the strongest people doing" and then jump on board without laying a foundation first. Now when you consider that too many amateur powerlifters do this and then compare how much strength a typical team athlete needs VS a powerlifter, it becomes very clear that for MOST team athletes, an advanced program like westside just isn't necessary. Does that make more sense?

PS - I know lots of drug free athletes using westside principles with tremendous success too. I have a friend who competes at 165 and has a 655 squat in competition and a 705 squat in the gym. The kid is a monster. He's also been training a long time.
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Old 08-19-2008, 11:11 AM   #13
Dave Van Skike
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Fasir enough. I was thinking more along the lines of strength athletes or speed athletes...not "ball players" ...but I'm biased like that.

What I meant to get at was more the idea that splits and split based programs requires either elite levels of fitness or drugs to be made to work...which we know to be bunk. For a lot of folks splits can be really effective, I think master's athletes and some atheltes in higher weight classes have similar challenges to elite strength athletes and "supplementing" atheletes, which is they have a disitinct need more recovery after intense sessions. but whatever, it all works.

as for drugs, let's not forget the beginning of the drug era is also the heyday of 5x5, Keys to Progress and all that...Anderson, Park, Bednarksi, all products of high frequency, full body lifting...that and little blue pills......
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Old 08-19-2008, 12:01 PM   #14
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I should clarify that when people use the term split I am thinking solely of body part splits - ie, arm day, chest day, leg day, etc with a ton of isolation and machine work. I have no problem with most routines that focuses on big compound movements.
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