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Old 04-07-2009, 12:24 AM   #11
Rafe Kelley
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Basically my belief is that when it comes to understanding optimal human fitness an evolutionary perspective is superior to one based in sport or sports science which is were I think crossfit so far has come from, though appeals to evolutionary logic are common in crossfit the overall system is not rooted in evolutionary theory. That is what I a big part of what Erwan has been trying to do with MovNat. I have had the oppurtonity to train with with Erwan twice, once in the city of Nice and once in Corsica during part of the filming of that sampler the two shoots including a partner sparring with Erwan are me the rest of my footage apparently didn't make the cut . I have also been working with crossfits for the last 2 years and training parkour for 4 years so I think I have some perspective on the debate.

Erwans approach has worked for him that is clear, I do fairly well at crossfit met cons, my grace time is 2:34, fran is 4:45, Erwan blew me away at anything involving stamina or endurance by a fair shot and his strength was fairly comparable even superior in upper body strength despite being 30 pounds lighter then me, I can squat 345 for 3 reps, single rep 425 in the deadlift, overhead press 145 and weighted pull ups with 90 pounds so not quite a crossfit monster but decently strong I think. Combine that physical capacity with the ability to move through complex environments, to fight, to deal with odd objects and I think it is simply a more real fitness then that provided by doing solely gym based training with consistently simple tools and movements. Just the games of catch Erwan likes to play would be scare the bejesus out of most good crossfitters IMHO standing barefoot on rough boulders above the ocean trying to catch sharp rocks hurled at you by a mad french man is definitely a unique fitness challenge.

The question now is whether the system Erwan has developed to teach what he does will teach athletes to achieve the same things as effectively as what Crossfit has produced. If your intrested give some of it a try or go to a seminar if you can afford to as the say in crossfit black box it.
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Old 04-07-2009, 01:03 AM   #12
Steven Low
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Good post Rafe.

Always interesting to see some actual experience from someone who has trained with the Erwan himself, CF & Parkour.
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Old 04-07-2009, 07:04 AM   #13
Garrett Smith
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Originally Posted by George Mounce View Post
Technology doesn't make people lazy, choice makes people lazy, and people frankly embrace the easy, its more efficient. But at the same time, if there were no bridges, buildings, fences, and staircases, we wouldn't have Parkour, or what the inventors of MovNat like to do! So therefore, their product comes from modern technology!
George, didn't you know MovNat came about because of pilots spending too much time on C2 rowing machines?!?!
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Old 04-07-2009, 08:47 AM   #14
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on the side note of his certs.....unless it has real potential to bring clients to the table, I wouldn't spend money on it....but that's just me from a business investment POV.
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Old 04-07-2009, 10:05 AM   #15
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George, didn't you know MovNat came about because of pilots spending too much time on C2 rowing machines?!?!
Touché...
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Old 04-07-2009, 11:47 AM   #16
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I think the MovNat is great. That being said, it would be really hard to take an out-of-shape, obese person and put them in a MovNat program to help them reach their goals (which is likely to lose bodyfat/weight) that wouldn't discourage them immediately due to their inability to do many things in the "natural" environment.

Building some basic strength in a gym environment might be a better place for folks like that to start.

The market for MovNat trainers will be so niche as to not really be marketable except in large cities with great parks (I'm thinking like Portland). There needs to be "city-fied" people with easy access to the "outdoors". That could be tough to find and market to.
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Old 04-07-2009, 11:56 AM   #17
Greg Battaglia
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Rafe,

I agree with you completely. I was thinking much of what you said, but you said it much better than me! Thanks for chiming in with your experience. I've been wanting to train with Erwan for some time now but don't have the funds to make it down to Brazil.

MOD,

Good point on the seminars. I'm having a blast just doing my own little approach to MovNat with no formal training. I just run through the woods at random, lifting heavy rocks, carrying them, sprinting, crossing streams, climbing trees and rocky structures, tossing rocks, climbing up steep hills, walking interspersed with sprints, walking across narrow logs and tree limbs to test my balance, etc. it's tons of fun and I feel great. I like this style of training more than CF because I feel vibrant and healthy after every session. With Crossfit I feel nauseous and sick after a hard workout. I think MovNat is a healthier long-term alternative.
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Old 04-07-2009, 12:01 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Greg Battaglia View Post
Rafe,

I agree with you completely. I was thinking much of what you said, but you said it much better than me! Thanks for chiming in with your experience. I've been wanting to train with Erwan for some time now but don't have the funds to make it down to Brazil.

MOD,

Good point on the seminars. I'm having a blast just doing my own little approach to MovNat with no formal training. I just run through the woods at random, lifting heavy rocks, carrying them, sprinting, crossing streams, climbing trees and rocky structures, tossing rocks, climbing up steep hills, walking interspersed with sprints, walking across narrow logs and tree limbs to test my balance, etc. it's tons of fun and I feel great. I like this style of training more than CF because I feel vibrant and healthy after every session. With Crossfit I feel nauseous and sick after a hard workout. I think MovNat is a healthier long-term alternative.
I thought nature was great, too, until I decided to join the military. Beaches, hills, logs, trails, mud = no fun.
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Old 04-07-2009, 12:07 PM   #19
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I thought nature was great, too, until I decided to join the military. Beaches, hills, logs, trails, mud = no fun.
I know you said beaches, but don't forget inland sand, lots of sand.

I will keep watching MovNat and see where it goes.
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Old 04-07-2009, 12:26 PM   #20
Rafe Kelley
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Just wanted to addresses a common misunderstanding it is not obligatory to do Movnat training in natural enviroments, or barefoot, or bareshirted, those are just considered ideal circumstances. I have taught MovNat classes in gyms. The key thing is to train to develop increasing physical and technical capacity across all the of the fundamental natural movements and not get caught up in using only single movements to represent a movement pattern such as only box jumps for jumping or only pull ups for climbing.
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