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Old 11-27-2009, 08:37 AM   #1
Clay Jones
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Join Date: Nov 2009
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Default Please Critique my Fat Loss Plan

I’m interested in getting some feedback on my planned fat loss program, Yeah, I’ll admit it, I’m fat. Comes from being Irish and liking potatoes. Honestly tho, I need to drop 25# or so.

A bit about me: 51 yo, been lifting since HS, most of it wasted on magazine workouts. Did CF, but am back to working on Oly lifts and GPP. I have a back surgery in my past plus some occasional shoulder discomfort (from Ju-Jitsu and volleyball), so I doubt I’ll ever be looking to lift really heavy. 6’4”, 270#, but I should really be under 250#, as I was really a skinny kid till I injured my back (I am probably a classic example of skinny-fat). My goal is to drop 20# for starters, and this will be my only fitness goal for the time being. No “I wanna get ripped/cut/Westside/Kettlebells/whatever” stuff. I have taken about 10# off so far, but I have to change up the diet I have been following (Eades 6 Week Cure).

Let me get the most important thing out of the way: Diet. I’ll be following a Paleo diet; I have been grain-free for the most part of the year, and I actually enjoy eating mostly meat and veggies, with the occasional piece of fruit. The only dairy I use is milk, but I may cut that out for the time being. My big issue is not food, but portion control (i can overeat if not keeping tabs), so I’ll be logging (but not measuring) my food. Also supplementing with D/A/Fish oil, that’s about it.

I’m going to stick to a GPP style workout, and was thinking of using a program Mike Moore posted a while back. It looks like this (edited):

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Moore View Post
Here's a barbell complex I use and have used with some of my wrestlers. I suggest starting with 3 or 4 "rounds" and using a rest interval between rounds of 1 1/2 minutes. Decrease RI by 15 seconds each week until you reach 45 seconds, then increase rounds by 1. Repeat process until you are doing 5-6 rounds, then instead of increasing rounds, increase weight. Anyway - 8 exercises (or as some prefer "movements" - some people will get that one), 6 reps each exercise (not as easy as it sounds once you hit the push presses), NEVER let go of the bar and never stop moving:

1. Deadlift
2. RDL
3. Bent Over Row
4. Cleans (from the floor or hang cleans - your choice - or Dan John's Whip Snatches)
5. Front Squat
6. Push Press
7. Back Squat (full)
8. Good Mornings
Link here, from PMenu forum: http://www.performancemenu.com/forum...wreply&p=10251

I have been doing this workout for the past week and like it, tho I may substitute some other movement for the good mornings. I’m starting pretty light, 75# or so. This would be the only workout I would do for 4-6 weeks.

My plan would be:

Day 1: Workout
Day 2: Workout
Day 3: Rest
Day 4: Workout
Day 5: Workout
Day 6: Work on Oly technique (very light lifts), or else just stretch/rest
Day 7: Rest

Given that I’m at that point in life where I need a little extra recovery, I may end up just resting on day 6. I’ll also be taking a few long hikes each week. I’ll also start a training log on the board to keep myself honest.

Thoughts, comments? See any weaknesses? Thanks in advance.
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Old 11-27-2009, 06:22 PM   #2
Derek Weaver
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I think it looks pretty good. That barbell complex though.... are you going to be doing that 4 days/week? I may not be reading that right.

If you are... I'd suggest something other than that frequency day in, day out.

Don't be afraid to get a calorie count for portions and then plus them in earlier. LIke you said, portion control is key. Knowing what your portions represent in relation to your metabolic rate is important.
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And if you don't think kettleball squat cleans are difficult, I say, step up to the med-ball
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Old 11-28-2009, 07:43 AM   #3
Clay Jones
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek Weaver View Post
I think it looks pretty good. That barbell complex though.... are you going to be doing that 4 days/week? I may not be reading that right.

If you are... I'd suggest something other than that frequency day in, day out.

Don't be afraid to get a calorie count for portions and then plus them in earlier. LIke you said, portion control is key. Knowing what your portions represent in relation to your metabolic rate is important.
Thanks for the input, Derek. I think your idea of using a calorie counter is great. I totaled up my C/P/F calories yesterday, and it was quite a eye-opener. I'm eating far more carbs than I thought.

I'm going to be aiming for 1g protein per lb. of lean body mass, then filling in with fats and carbs. I'm going to restrict carbs to veggies and some fruits. 1 cheat meal per week. I just ran across dietgenie which will be a big help.

As for the BB complex, I would be doing the same number of reps each time, but adding to the # of sets each workout plus reducing the rest time between sets. So day 1 I'd do 3 rounds, day 2 I'd do 4, and so on. Any ideas on how to vary the programming? I chose it because it would be easy to do (initially) plus I could get it done in 20--25 minutes in the AM, before work. I'm open to suggestions as far as sets/reps/frequency, as well as other exercises. I have thought about subbing in a strength day or Oly lifting day for one of the days, but since fat loss is the primary goal I don't know if it would help.

Thanks again.
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Old 11-28-2009, 03:23 PM   #4
Derek Weaver
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I think maybe calorie king or one of those books that is readily available at a pharmacy or drug store would b a good idea. At least for a while to figure out what/how much you actually eat.

To vary the programming... I'd switch things to either 3 full body-ish workouts with the BB complex as a "finisher" if it's something you need, or upper lower 3-4 days/week. I just wouldn't repeat the same complex over and over expecting the weight to increase and rest times to consistently decrease.

I think a better idea is to do your strength stuff, remember to lift heavy and increase activity level another. Hikes, walks, cycling, rowing, swimming etc. Low impact stuff.

Basically a low weight (relative to your actual strength levels) BB complex every day is a bad idea.
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And if you don't think kettleball squat cleans are difficult, I say, step up to the med-ball
- CJ Kim
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Old 11-29-2009, 04:52 AM   #5
Jay Cohen
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Location: Western Pa
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80 % of body composition is determined in the kitchen, strength is determined in the gym, this is appx, don't quote me and no, I don't have any studies to back it up.

Hence if you're primary goal is to loose fat, YOU HAVE TO DIAL IN YOUR EATING. Track via Fitday or some other program, every single bite you take in, give it 30 days until you get a feel for what and how much you're eating. Paleo is fine, but, you can still gain weight.

Determine your time line to reach your goal weight, post it around the house and understand, it's a battle and you need to really NOT cheat(at least for 30 days), determine your macro %%'s that work for you , then stick with it. If you want to loose 25 lbs in 5 months, well, that's 5 lbs per month, or about 1.25 per week. Sounds doable, but, you have to stay focused.

Mike O said it best, Loose weight, eat less, Gain weight eat more. See, this sounds simple and you're shaking your head, going, " I know that", well the fact is, weight gain/loose is simple stuff, but people are looking for formula's or plans to follow, way over complicating it.

Pick up the fork more, or less, you choice.

That's my 2 cents on this Sunday morning...................
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Old 11-29-2009, 05:29 AM   #6
George Mounce
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Location: Mississippi
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Jay hit it right, the food you eat is the best determining factor in your body composition.

Eat foods that has what your body needs and you'll not only eat less, but your composition will follow suit.
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Old 11-29-2009, 09:58 AM   #7
Clay Jones
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Default Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek Weaver View Post
To vary the programming... I'd switch things to either 3 full body-ish workouts with the BB complex as a "finisher" if it's something you need, or upper lower 3-4 days/week. I just wouldn't repeat the same complex over and over expecting the weight to increase and rest times to consistently decrease.

I think a better idea is to do your strength stuff, remember to lift heavy and increase activity level another. Hikes, walks, cycling, rowing, swimming etc. Low impact stuff.
Derek, I had to think about that a bit, but it makes sense. I like your idea of adding the complex in after a strength workout. I知 now leaning toward a 3 day whole body WO, that way I can toss in some extra hikes and the like.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Cohen View Post
80 % of body composition is determined in the kitchen, strength is determined in the gym, this is appx, don't quote me and no, I don't have any studies to back it up.

Hence if you're primary goal is to loose fat, YOU HAVE TO DIAL IN YOUR EATING. Track via Fitday or some other program, every single bite you take in, give it 30 days until you get a feel for what and how much you're eating. Paleo is fine, but, you can still gain weight.

Determine your time line to reach your goal weight, post it around the house and understand, it's a battle and you need to really NOT cheat(at least for 30 days), determine your macro %%'s that work for you , then stick with it. If you want to loose 25 lbs in 5 months, well, that's 5 lbs per month, or about 1.25 per week. Sounds doable, but, you have to stay focused.

Pick up the fork more, or less, you choice.
Thanks Jay. I may make your "pick up the fork" line my sig.

All of what you say makes sense. I have been logging my food for the past few days, and it is clear to me that what I thought I was eating and what I am actually eating are two different things. I知 taking in too many carbs, not enough protein and fat. I値l need to play around with the macro percentages, but my immediate response will be to cut out the junk/excess carbs. I知 going to start with a max of ~80g of carbs per day, and adjust it each week (I'll need to play with my carb levels a bit).

I知 going to set a goal of a pound a week and give myself a deadline for the first 20 lbs. If I lose more, great. I think a pound a week is rational. I値l check out Fitday, but I will probably keep a paper log and use a calorie counter book in the beginning. I have been recording my daily food intake in my training log, which it is actually working out pretty well. I may toss in an occasional IF day, but my focus will need to be my daily calorie intake.

Looks like I have some work to do.

Thanks for all the responses.
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Old 11-29-2009, 11:45 AM   #8
Derek Weaver
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I'm glad to see Jay's still around here from time to time. Good to see you post my friend.

The 80% diet rule is a good and accurate one. Kinda Paretto's Principle with that whole 80/20 thing.

A couple points I'd add:
Don't fear carbs. They do a few good things and are not completely and utterly evil. I would keep them primarily "Paleo" though in terms of tolerance. LImit sugar, keep starches to yams, sweet potatoes, carrots and other roots and tubers. Fruit is harder to overdo than most think, but can be done. Keep things to water heavy choices like berries, oranges, apples etc and you should be fine.

I'd honestly set macros on grams/lb instead of percentages.
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Quote:
And if you don't think kettleball squat cleans are difficult, I say, step up to the med-ball
- CJ Kim
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Old 11-29-2009, 07:11 PM   #9
Clay Jones
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Join Date: Nov 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek Weaver View Post

I'd honestly set macros on grams/lb instead of percentages.
It took me a while but I figured this out (I'm a bit dense); I ran across one of your other posts where you outline the method. I'll do the calc and post some numbers later, using desired (finishing) weight. That should give me a slight deficit to work with. edit: I think my earlier estimate of 80g carbs/day was a bit low, given my height/weight.

Those carb choices sound like they will work for me, I have never been a fan of sweet potatoes but I did try some with dinner tonight (TJ's has them pre-sliced, talk about lazy). I'm also busy coming up with some carb options for work, as I tend to overeat (carbs esp) when stressed. I'm planning on avoiding the break room at work, as someone always brings in some sort of carb surprise, presented with the disclaimer "but it's low fat!"

I'm going to do a test run this week, If all goes well I'll start my log next week.

Thanks Derek.

Last edited by Clay Jones : 11-29-2009 at 08:12 PM. Reason: excessive brain density
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Old 11-29-2009, 08:44 PM   #10
Derek Weaver
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Anytime Clay. Feel free to PM me if you have specific questions you don't want to post. I've made every mistake, many times more than once.

Don't be afraid to experiment with different ways to prepare the sweet potatoes. Just be mindful of any additives and oils that may be used. Easy way to let energy intake creep up on you.

I got curious, and am also a big geek, after the other post I made today and worked out rough estimates of macros, cals and maintenance. If you'd like I can post them up or PM them to you. Or I can back off since it's your goals and project.
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And if you don't think kettleball squat cleans are difficult, I say, step up to the med-ball
- CJ Kim
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