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Old 01-19-2010, 06:31 PM   #1
Emily Mattes
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Default Programming/Accessory Exercises for developing timing and speed under the bar

I can clean pull 105 and snatch pull 85 off the ground no problem. I have tremendous trouble consistently cleaning 80 or snatching 60. One of the reasons is that my timing and speed under the bar sucks.

Can anyone recommend a good programming scheme of adding exercises to my normal Oly program to help with this? I train 5 days a week, and this is what I'm thinking now:

High-hang snatches 1x/week
High-hang cleans 1x/week
Power clean/power snatch work 1x/week
Box jumps 1x/week
Depth jumps 1x/week

Plus whatever conditioning work I do, and of course focusing on being explosive during my normal lifting.

Should I add more? Less? Any specific exercises you've found to be very helpful for your own or your athletes' training? I know if I were doing strength exercises I'd face the problem of diminishing returns from adding more and more, but how much is this the case with speed?
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Old 01-19-2010, 07:23 PM   #2
Brian DeGennaro
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Tall variations of the lifts are always good too, really help to train that turnover. Personally I find that what you are cuing and telling yourself helps with the turnover better than most exercises.

- Ripping yourself under the bar, attacking the bottom position, etc.
- Timing the replacement of your feet (stomp) with snapping your elbows overhead/rack
- Trying to raise the bar minimally and race under it

There's a million different ways to imagine it and think of the turnover. I've told people their arms are like a mousetrap snapping shut (elbows snapping up). Whatever you can tell yourself, imagine, cue, etcetera that gets you doing the right thing, keep doing it.
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Old 01-19-2010, 10:35 PM   #3
Blair Lowe
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Is your problem the 2nd or the 3rd pull?
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Old 01-19-2010, 10:42 PM   #4
Emily Mattes
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Brian, I do try to keep my focus on that turnover--I will think about turning over at the same time my feet hit the ground though, haven't been doing that.

Blair, I would say both. I've gotten faster, but fast for me is still half-speed for everyone else. People who watch me say I have little acceleration through the second pull, and as for the third pull my elbows and shrug under are slow as hell.
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Old 01-20-2010, 04:49 AM   #5
Ian Gallimore
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Emily, I'd cut out the power versions. If you're having trouble getting under the bar they'll only make it worse, because they'll turn you into a chicken who spends too much time hanging around waiting for the bar to get "high enough". It's always high enough, if you're fast enough, which you say you are not.

Speed under is very much a function of the speed of your second pull - if you really attack the middle of the lift you will be faster under as a consequence. Whilst tall versions are great for honing bar path and body position during the pull under, and thus great things to have in your warmups, IMO you'd be better served by really working on speed through the middle with the full lifts so you really get a feel for accelerating the bar. There's a great quote from Jim Hooper I always refer back to that goes: "

Its not: (a) Extend your legs. (b) extend your hips. (c) rise up on your toes. (d) perform a shrug. (e) drop into a squat. (f) push up and lock out the bar. Its about a) SquueeeezzzecrankfasterBAMdowntight. One movement, and frankly way too fast to be thinking of specific component movements while you are doing it."

High hang lifts basically have you working on the "BAMdowntight", but from what you say the problem begins much earlier than that. For that reason I'd work the full lifts, from the floor, and really work on that middle part, regardless of weight on the bar. I don't know if you ever seen Halil Mutlu warming up, but he attacks a 40kg snatch just as hard as a 100kg snatch. The guy commits to every lift, and doesn't wait until it's "heavy" before really cranking it up - for some people it's already too late by then.
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Old 01-20-2010, 08:09 AM   #6
Amy Carson
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Quote:
- Ripping yourself under the bar, attacking the bottom position, etc.
- Timing the replacement of your feet (stomp) with snapping your elbows overhead/rack
- Trying to raise the bar minimally and race under it
For me, this is the best advice. Especially the "raise the bar minimally and race under it."

I'm no expert, not even close. But I've been struggling with cleans for a while, trying to get to 100lbs and I FINALLY did with a few pointers. I had some of the same issues as you have. I was getting the bar plenty high but not getting under it fast or low enough.

Now I've been looking at it differently. Not how high I can get the bar but getting low enough to catch it.

A lot of it is mental for me. Good luck!
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Old 01-20-2010, 08:19 AM   #7
Michael McKenna
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What does Victor say?

Singles, with 30-60 seconds rest between reps. Singles.
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Old 01-20-2010, 07:28 PM   #8
Emily Mattes
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Victor says I just need more time. But I'm impatient!
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Old 01-20-2010, 07:39 PM   #9
Brian DeGennaro
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What you cue yourself with can sometimes make your technique and speed day and night, even changing your starting position. Different strokes for different folks. Think of everything possible to help you imagine and feel the speed of the lift, watch the lift in your mind, feel it movement by movement.
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Old 01-21-2010, 06:43 AM   #10
Michael McKenna
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Festina Lente, Ms. Mattes.
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