Go Back   Catalyst Athletics Forums > Training > Olympic Weightlifting

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-31-2010, 08:01 AM   #1
Martin Bonn
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 210
Default Rebuilding FS technique

Hi all,

so my squatting sucks (badly) and I've decided to rebulid my technique, otherwise I'll never make any progress in Oly lifting.
I'm looking for some advice, not just for me but in general, on how to rebulid a FS when you have bad motor patterns engrained.

Here's what I'm doing atm:
I still need to FS somewhat heavy, otherwise I lose what little strength I have, but then I'm dropping back to ~50% and do a couple of sets of 3 with a pause at the bottom. focusing on keeping my back extended and my torso straight when recovering. i also stretch after every workout for about 20min.

My particular problem is the butt coming up too quickly, I then lean forward and lose the bar.
I've tried different things like chest up, elbows up etc but that doesn t seem to work for me.

what do you guys suggest in terms of exercises etc?

Here's an example of the sets of three: 60kgx3 w5sec pause
and here's one with max weight (funnily enough it looks the same with about 100kg): 111kgx1

thanks for your help!
__________________
Stats: 26yrs, 6'1'', 98.0kg
Snatch: 103kg
Clean & Jerk: 124kg
TOTAL: 227kg

__________________________________________
Log

Youtube
Martin Bonn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2010, 08:16 AM   #2
Brandon Oto
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 299
Default

Just what is making you think about "motor patterns" rather than thinking that your hamstrings are strong and your quads/glutes are weak?
__________________
Log | AGT template | Website | Stats and videos
Brandon Oto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2010, 08:55 AM   #3
Martin Bonn
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 210
Default

That's another thing that doesn't help! I've always deadlifted way more than I squat! So do you think that's the main issue, rather than bad technique itself?
__________________
Stats: 26yrs, 6'1'', 98.0kg
Snatch: 103kg
Clean & Jerk: 124kg
TOTAL: 227kg

__________________________________________
Log

Youtube
Martin Bonn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2010, 09:48 AM   #4
Brian DeGennaro
Senior Member
 
Brian DeGennaro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Baldwin, NY
Posts: 513
Default

What do you deadlift?

It looks to me, that you break at the knees early rather than a simultaneous hip/knee break.
Brian DeGennaro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2010, 12:52 PM   #5
Martin Bonn
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 210
Default

I used to DL 170x3x3 ...never really maxed out. this was high hip, Rip style (which works well for me having long legs and all that).
HBBS is 120kg at the most...with really bad technique, more of a good morning tbh!

I dont DL anymore...just do pulls. My clean pulls are up to 150x3 with good form and a decent second pull (lots of power, i just can't stand up with the weight!)

do i break early at the knees even when i do the 60kgx3? they felt better on the way down, much more upright! i just can't maintain that on the way up, even with lightish weights.

maybe brandon is right and i just have extra weak quads (which i do) and i always try to compensate using my hams!
__________________
Stats: 26yrs, 6'1'', 98.0kg
Snatch: 103kg
Clean & Jerk: 124kg
TOTAL: 227kg

__________________________________________
Log

Youtube
Martin Bonn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2010, 01:30 PM   #6
Brandon Oto
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 299
Default

Shrug. I can't tell you your own body, but lousy quads compared to hamstrings was the story for me for a long time and I had the same issues. Just something you gotta work on.

Some glute activation MAY be somewhat helpful.
__________________
Log | AGT template | Website | Stats and videos
Brandon Oto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2010, 02:09 PM   #7
Martin Bonn
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 210
Default

i know what you mean, all these things have been going through my head for a while. it's just difficult to put your finger on it yourself sometimes and it's that outsider viewpoint that does the trick.

tbh, it's probably a combination of quad weakness and bad form (the former maybe due to the latter), i just wanted to know if there is something i m doin fundamentally wrong.
__________________
Stats: 26yrs, 6'1'', 98.0kg
Snatch: 103kg
Clean & Jerk: 124kg
TOTAL: 227kg

__________________________________________
Log

Youtube
Martin Bonn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2010, 02:22 PM   #8
Brandon Oto
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 299
Default

Well, as far as form meets strength, you basically have to pick a certain amount of lean you'll allow in your squats (and whatnot), and stick to it. I wouldn't say everything has to be perfect or you won't be moving much weight, but if you're turning your front squats into good mornings the problem is going to self-perpetuate.

Front squats, highbar backsquats, and safety bar squats did good by me. Find your poison.
__________________
Log | AGT template | Website | Stats and videos
Brandon Oto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2010, 10:45 AM   #9
Gant Grimes
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,373
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Bonn View Post
so my squatting sucks (badly) and I've decided to rebulid my technique...I'm looking for some advice...on how to rebulid a FS when you have bad motor patterns engrained.

...

I still need to FS somewhat heavy, otherwise I lose what little strength I have
Your methods are inconsistent with your goals.
__________________
"It should be more like birthday party than physics class." | Log | 70's Big
Gant Grimes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2010, 02:50 PM   #10
Arden Cogar Jr.
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 694
Default

Last week, I agreed, with myself, to partake upon a major commitment to improving my front squat.

I don't know if my own goal will help Martin any, but I wanted to share with the hope that it would.

I recently started backsquatting heavy again and the decrepency between what I can front squat and what I can back squat is quite amazing. So I'm dropping the back squats (which I currently do twice every six days) and doing a front squat varient instead.

Day 1 - low box power snatch, OHS, front squat 5 sets of 3 - top sets will be triples 3 sets of 3 with no more than 75% of 1 RM
Day 3 - low box squat clean, push press, front squat - this will be my stoopid day where I will set the pins high and 1/2 and 1/4 front squat weights that would make most buckle.
Day 5 - snatch, clean and jerk, front squat - this will be my 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 day. The 1 will go up and down and range between 95% and 85% depending upon the work load for the week. If I feel strong that day, I may try close to PR, but only on my heavy wave weeks.

Days 2, 4 and 6 are event training. In case anyone cares.

The idea is to expose my body to the movement more. Day 1 is searching for perfect technique. Day 3 is searching for absolute strength while limting the ROM (I've done in the 6s this way before). Day 5 is bring the full ROM pain.

Just a thought.

The more you do a movement, the better you get at it. If you want to improve your front squat. Front squat more.

all the best,
ARden
__________________
Lifting heavy stuff is fun and relative......
Arden Cogar Jr. is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:52 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9 Beta 3
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.