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Old 01-31-2011, 11:45 AM   #611
Derek Weaver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Wilson View Post
Bryan, first you didn't understand why 30 reps with olympic lifts is a terrible and pointless idea,
then you say Dave Castro's 24 second deadlift was good form:



(courtesy to Clay)

Now your saying that 66 deadlifts with four 400 meters sprints, done for time, maximally, is NOT going to cause hamstrings tears.

LOL I do not know how to respond to this, its hilarious.


Bryan's post reminds me, this is a great opportunity to refresh the stages of cult behavior associated with CrossFit, similar to Dante's Inferno, this is Glassman's Inferno. Its the development stage of the CrossFitter, a burden we've all had to experience unfortunately:



Stage -2
People unaware of CrossFit.

Stage -1
Normal people. Burdened by the repetative obnoxious CrossFit behavior, CrossFit won't go away, resorted to making fun of it. Especially when CrossFitters won't shut the fuck up.

________________Depths of Glassman's Inferno______________________

Stage 1 CrossFitter (purgatory)
Does not give a shit about CrossFit philosophy, just wants to make money off it.

Stage 2 CrossFitter
Does not give a shit about CF philosophy, just wants lose weight and exercise without going to a gym with body builders; that would shatter their self esteem, randomly stumbles upon a CrossFit gym.

Stage 3 CrossFitter
Believes in CF, mediocre performer at best, lacks knowledge and experience in anything sport & exercise science, yet considers themselves an expert and coach. Religiously rejects any alternative sport, established research, and training means, thinks their opinion is valued and respected (its not) as they quote Greg Glassman and the CrossFit Journal, which they consider messages from the gods. Anything outside this stream of information, confuses them, and like cult zombies, they attack it. Determined to gain attention by outwardly showing the CrossFit affection via vomitting terrible information, crazy recommendations, and wears CrossFit branded clothing to display their dominance among normal people that do not give a shit. Believes in punishment training, but is too scared to break the "elite threshold" into injury. This is the only rational piece of thinking left in their consciousness, beyond this, it's complete nonsense and hard headed belief in CrossFit, which they believe, is sanctum. You'll find them frequently posting on the CrossFit messageboards, trolling in other forums about elite crossfit methodology superiority over everything else and gravely insulted when someone refutes it, they're always changing their facebook pictures to something CrossFit to gain repect and acknowledgement, and telling other people to do CrossFit.

Stage 4 CrossFitter
Attempting to break the "elite threshold" gets injuried from CF, average performer at best and will never improve beyond this. They're on the brink of total CrossFit injury martyr or CrossFit quiter. They begin to question the legitimacy and effectiveness of CF.com or affliate, two paths are either chosen: quit CrossFitting and do something else, ie Starting Strength, 5/3/1, or .......
Death before DNF.
The first path, the person finds themself staring at the poison kool aid cup, sitting quietly in their hand, as everyone else around them chugs it, kills over and dies in their own vomit and urine. Their fate branches from this moment. Some stop themselves after watching their co-exercises kill over, most are not this lucky.
The second path, the person chugs the kool aid, decides the only way to become better at CF, is to do more CF, at the most extreme level possible. They start doing 2-3 wods a day, CF add ons like CFE, with completely random irresponsible programming and over the top combinations. Their belief is magnified. They start their own CrossFit poetry blog, and begin flagrantly expressing the emotional break downs caused by workouts, and what it means to them as a person to be an elite exerciser, compared to everyone else, that doesn't do functional movements at high intensity; they're adamant about sharing their online workout log when no one cares. They up the attention seeking by starting their own youtube channel, video taping themselves, hoping other CFers will respect their suicidal exercise tendencies, and validate the only thing they ever wanted... to be considered elite. Then the chronic injuries happen.


Stage 5 Crossfitters
Full belief in CF, their life mission is to compete in Games, but will never make it because they suck and too stupid to do normal, research backed training; that would be anti CrossFit and specialist. They become a CrossFit martyr. Rattled with chronic injuries and weak all around strength, with shit weightlifting technique, the multiple wods a day and addons never worked in their training, of course it didn't. It crushed them. They're left with a stupid blog with pictures of them in tie die knee high socks, shirtless, bleeding on the floor from their palms, and bragging about their sweat patterns left on the floor because they forgot chairs and t shirts existed. Their youtube videos that once had fellow CrossFitters displaying appreciation for their suicidal workouts, has been comment-less for 6 months. They, as a potential elite CrossFitter, potentially one of the fittest human beings on Earth, have been forgotten. So they punish their facebook account, making their facebook friends pay for the lack of attention, status updates, photo albums dedicated to wods, competitions, and their crossfit tattoos, everyday video taping their workouts, constant friending hundreds of people they've never met. And no one gives a shit. They then spend the next 2 years of their life, on and off CrossFit.com remenicing on how elite they used to be and once had their WOD video posted on SICFIT.com, they then start an affiliate to exercise punish other people.

Stage 6 CrossFitter
Full belief in CF, competes in Games, thinks or are told they're an elite athlete, make their own clothing line. These are the reject athletes or bodybuilders. People that have successfully played in sports either college or semi pro, were average at best, could never make it top shelf and retire in glory, and stumbled upon CrossFit, discovering that because they have a background in sports training with actual skills and conventional training, are able to crush 90% of the other yuppie middle aged CrossFitters who completely lack that background. People immediately recognize their elite potential. Random people start video taping them, ask to take pictures with them to put on their facebook, come up and ask for advice to get on their elite GPP level, that will never never happen. They find themselves being told to compete in the Games, they soon believe they're elite, begin with fitness duels to continue to feed this ego and self concept forged on exercising no normal person would do. CrossFit HQ spots them, gets a hard on, and because they're fresh meat, absent of CF injuries and desperate poetry blogs talking about elite fitness, give them a Progenex deal while start glorifying them on CrossFit.com, saying this is what CrossFit makes.

Stage 7 CrossFitter
Full belief in CF, doesn't exercise because of total injury caused by CrossFit or consider themselves an elite coach and don't need to. Regardless of the extremeness in injury CF has caused to, they still believe full in CF. This is the final stage. The concentration of CF ideology is at a maximum quality. There is no longer dismissal of rational, normal research backed training from exercise and sports science, but COMPLETE REJECTION and HATRED for it. They are caught in CF videos insulting other sports, researchers, physicians, nutritionists, and challenging them to duels; people that do not know CrossFit even exists, to PROVE CrossFit's unconventional, DOMINANT TRAINING METHODOLOGY. They're so rich in their belief in CF and the CF Journal that they see themselves to have "greater academia" then any established and legitimate phd or olympic coach. These are the wod makers, the people that think they're prominant revolutionary scientists and experts, often reciting 9th grade biology and physics lessons during fitness conversations. They're so destroyed in the past years from irrational training methods, permanent injury, and stale novice levels of sports performance, they have no physical performance abilities left. Their physical appearance is that of an alcoholic or transgender; men shaped as women, with women features, or so impressed with themselves that their superiority of fitness knowledge far exceeds any physical capability of their CF drones. What drives them is their push for more dominance. They got away with attacking legitimate people who either do not know CF exists, or do not give a shit, and are now going mainstream. Globo Gyms were the past, the Olympics is next. FH heart study is next. The Nobel Prize is next. The specialists and academia have to realize they're weak and inferior to the CrossFit training methodology. The whole motivation and movement is actually based on their deep down self image of them being weak, and invaluable, they have to prove themselves. The more successful they are in CrossFit, the greater compensation for this hidden self perception of being weak. They must drive harder, become icons of fitness, world revolutionaries. They will show them, show how everyone else is weaker. No matter how much bullshit they have to sell.
Then they walk up to a chalk board.
The fitness revolution must be fed.
All counter efforts must be given the STFU therapy
Whoa. Had to quote it so it doesn't go away somehow.

Bryan,
As a follow up to your post explaining where you are coming from. Thanks for telling us what your background is and how you believe GG's philosophy is working for you.

Crossfit claims to develop everyday decathletes. You know, 10 broad time and modal domains vs. 10 actual athletic events. Yet every one of them has numbers that suck.

Andrew pointed out that the top decathletes are more or less within 92% of the WR for each event. Even though they don't specialize. There isn't a CFer alive who is anywhere near that level of fitness, unless you count a WR Box Jump (nothing more functional than a life or death ascent up a box). Of course, we're not talking about actually throwing the javelin (unless it's for time and you sub in Lawn Darts), or pole vaulting (not sure where to begin on that one). But to claim that CFers do what specialized athletes do almost as well, and that the specializers can't do their stuff at all.... and you do what neither of you do better..... is a pile of crap. CFers do everything mediocre at best. Including arguing.
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Old 01-31-2011, 12:49 PM   #612
Pat McElhone
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Andrew,

Bravo! Your best yet. I saw myself at stage 4.

Brian,

What is your height/weight? What was your best push-ups, sit-up and run times before and after CrossFit training? Not scores, but raw numbers please. Thanks Brian, your answers go a long way toward validating or invalidating my opinions about CF.
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Old 01-31-2011, 01:15 PM   #613
Ryan Lyman
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BTW, i'd also like to thank Andrew for introducing me to pole-vaulting women (i wanted to say 'turning me on to...' but that might give the wrong impression). it would do my son well if he were to get into that sport when he is older, or at least hang around the girls somehow....

at any rate, the inferno post was pretty much game, set, match, again again, and again. i've lost track how many great points AW et al has made. i was probably a solid level 3 or 4.

bryan, by your own choice have you chosen to read this thread. if you don't like it, don't read it....no one is forcing you to.
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Old 01-31-2011, 01:31 PM   #614
Bryan Kemper
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With regard to the Glassman Inferno post, interesting insight. There are some nuggets of truth in there, but overall....FRAT.

I still stand behind what I said in my post about Castro's "epic" prolonged deadlift. Was it pretty? Not in the least. Was his back rounded out like so much of the crap you see posted on youtube. No. Would it have been better not to post the video....most assuredly. But he was tenacious at completing the lift.

To be perfectly honest, I really don't know why I keep reading this thread. I don't agree with many of the naysayers on this thread and I obviously don't have the proper education/training background to know **** from shinola. There is so much other valuable information on CA/PM that brings me back. I enjoy and respect the Crossfit methodology and hope to open an affiliate of my own one day. An affiliate that provides excellent training and results to a wide variety of people.
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Old 01-31-2011, 01:38 PM   #615
Bryan Kemper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat McElhone View Post
Andrew,

Bravo! Your best yet. I saw myself at stage 4.

Brian,

What is your height/weight? What was your best push-ups, sit-up and run times before and after CrossFit training? Not scores, but raw numbers please. Thanks Brian, your answers go a long way toward validating or invalidating my opinions about CF.
Pat,

I am 6 ft/205 lbs. I don't have access to prior PT scores since I am not at work today. Suffice it to say that I was the typical person who crammed pushups, situps and running as my sole source of preparation for my annual PT test. I did not train other than run a few times a week. I have been able to max out my push ups and sit ups in under 45 secs or continue over and above my age max each time. Other airmen 20 years younger than I struggled to complete 25 of either. In my past three 1.5 mile run tests, I have not had anyone finish before me and I was the oldest one on the course. That can either be a testament to good training or a commentary on the AF fitness culture.
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Old 01-31-2011, 01:48 PM   #616
Derek Weaver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Kemper View Post
With regard to the Glassman Inferno post, interesting insight. There are some nuggets of truth in there, but overall....FRAT.

I still stand behind what I said in my post about Castro's "epic" prolonged deadlift. Was it pretty? Not in the least. Was his back rounded out like so much of the crap you see posted on youtube. No. Would it have been better not to post the video....most assuredly. But he was tenacious at completing the lift.

To be perfectly honest, I really don't know why I keep reading this thread. I don't agree with many of the naysayers on this thread and I obviously don't have the proper education/training background to know **** from shinola. There is so much other valuable information on CA/PM that brings me back. I enjoy and respect the Crossfit methodology and hope to open an affiliate of my own one day. An affiliate that provides excellent training and results to a wide variety of people.
FRAT?
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And if you don't think kettleball squat cleans are difficult, I say, step up to the med-ball
- CJ Kim
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Old 01-31-2011, 02:01 PM   #617
Donald Lee
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryan Kemper View Post
I still stand behind what I said in my post about Castro's "epic" prolonged deadlift. Was it pretty? Not in the least. Was his back rounded out like so much of the crap you see posted on youtube. No. Would it have been better not to post the video....most assuredly. But he was tenacious at completing the lift.
Bryan,

That video in general was fairly sad.

I agree with the sentiment of this guy from the Starting Strength forum who said this:

Quote:
These guys are just your typical gym bros, just that they happen to do crossfit.
I can't say that the type of stuff you see in that video is only seen from CrossFitters, however. You see that stuff with a lot of geared Powerlifters and I'm going to assume, with a lot of Strongmen.

There was a lot of ego in that video. People congratulating each other for lifts that looked horrible...some worse than others. That video showed a lot of what happens when you throw technique out the window and try to muscle and psych your way to PR's.

Dave Castro's technique was absolutely horrendous-not only on the Deadlift but also on the Back Squat. And what's the point of being tenacious in a ME Deadlift attempt when it looks that ugly? When your lifting looks that ugly, you should be working on your technique.

And part of the reason his back wasn't rounding was because he compensated by bringing his knees forward and trying to rest the bar against his legs.

Since when was hitching allowed in the Deadlift? Strongmen can hitch because that's a part of their events.

CrossFit should be ashamed at what they've become. Does Dave Castro look like he should be leading a fitness organization as large as CrossFit? I wouldn't take any fitness advice from that guy.
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Old 01-31-2011, 02:18 PM   #618
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I was a solid 3 or 4 Stage, and I even helped open an affiliate, and infect two other folks who ended up opening affiliates.

CF in AZ owes quite a bit to my Kool-Aid drinking days.
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Old 01-31-2011, 02:38 PM   #619
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Old 01-31-2011, 02:41 PM   #620
Derek Weaver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donald Lee;86286... Does Dave Castro look like he should be leading a fitness organization as large as CrossFit? [B
I wouldn't take any fitness advice from that guy.[/b]
What about this guy?


I would say I was at least a Stage 3, more like a Stage 4 CF'er.

It seems like the deeper one gets without actually hitting the True Devotion stage, the harder the fall.
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