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-   -   Olympic Lifting & Starting Strength (http://www.catalystathletics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2813)

Emily Mattes 08-01-2008 10:24 AM

Olympic Lifting & Starting Strength
 
I started Olympic Lifting about a month ago, and it is freakin' fantastic. My technique is improving and my lifts are going up. I lift about four days a week.

However, at some point I'd also like to try the Starting Strength program to see where it takes me. I'm not ready to do that just yet--I'm having too much damn fun right now. So, if you were me, how would you time the SS program with your Olympic lifting? Would you do Olympic lifting until you stopped seeing significant improvement, and then do SS? Try to create a hybrid SS-Olympic lifting program? Or abandon the idea of doing SS entirely, since perhaps once I've done a couple months of Olympic lifting I shouldn't be considered a novice any more?

I've been toying with doing SS as I want to get stronger to fulfill my secret desire of becoming The Hulk. But if Olympic lifting is going to have the same results at the same speed (or faster), then I'm open to the idea that SS isn't right for me.

Arien Malec 08-01-2008 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emily Mattes (Post 36002)
I started Olympic Lifting about a month ago, and it is freakin' fantastic. My technique is improving and my lifts are going up. I lift about four days a week.

However, at some point I'd also like to try the Starting Strength program to see where it takes me. I'm not ready to do that just yet--I'm having too much damn fun right now. So, if you were me, how would you time the SS program with your Olympic lifting?

If you've just started oly lifting, you are hopefully working with fairly light weights working primarily on technique.

Given that, it should be possible to work in a SS linear progression approach ASAP. Earlier is better to ensure the most linear progress before stall out.

Just work in your technique prior to the SS work. Perhaps alternate hang power movements in the power clean slot in the SS template as well to work on less technique dependent power.

For a 4 day template, perhaps:

M: sn med, c&j med, sq 3x5, press 3x5, dl: 1x5
Tu: light technique work (tall snatches, cleans, snatch balance, etc.)
W: rest
Th: sn, c&j med, sq 3x5, bp 3x5, hps
F: rest
Sa: sn, c&j med, sq 3x5, press 3x5, dl: 1x5
Su: rest
M: sn, c&j med, sq 3x5, bp: 3x5, hpc
etc...

John Alston 08-01-2008 10:50 AM

I'd say a couple months is still novice for Oly lifting.
Really, OL and SS are different. One is a sport. One is a training program.
But you can add benching to your OL training. If you are doing lots of squatting and accessory work you will see growth with an Oly focused program. The more accessory work, the more you can expand beyond OL.
Personally I saw my best gains in all areas when I was doing OL Mon and Wed, quick Squat workout Thursday with a little extra, and then another regular gym routine Saturday (squat, press, pull, row, not BB, 5x5, etc) for a total of 3 days squatting, MTrSat. I was also a few month novice OL at this time. Looking back, my greatest diffeciency might have been eating - I bet I should have eaten more.
There's a mass gain program on this PM thing that has a lot of OL lifts that seems to have had success in building strength and size for some people. It might be worth it in your Hulk Quest.
Remember, the Hulk is explosive. He jumps miles. So the quick lifts are great to make a key to your program, I think.

Kevin Perry 08-01-2008 11:29 AM

I tend to focus on one over the other. For example, right now im doing starting strength to build strength up in preperation of going into the Oly lifts full time. To keep fairly fresh in Oly work, my warm-ups consist entirely of practicing all the balances for 10 - 20 minutes. Heavy form work mainly.

So if you wanted to focus on SS for a while you could do so without sacrificing much Oly work.

Another good way to go for fitting in 4 dys a week might be doing SS M/W/F and fitting in a light Oly Day in the middle.

But um, Greg is the master at this so maybe he could chime in.

Dave Ogilbee 08-01-2008 12:15 PM

I'm in a similar boat Emily, though instead of SS, I'm more geared towards Metcons. I really enjoy doing both, but I concider the Oly lifts more of a fun hobby. I basically do Mectons during the week with a 3 on 1 off schedule, peppering in Oly days instead of metcons as I go. I'm thinking of taking a different approach scheduling my week around alternating more serious Oly lifting and metcon days. I'm wondering if doing too many metcons during the week is going to eat into strength gains for Oly lifts?

And as far as Superhero status goes, i'd have to lean more towards Thor myself. Though that could be the Scandi in me talking :)

John Alston 08-01-2008 12:35 PM

I was a Hulk freak when I was tiny.

Emily Mattes 08-01-2008 07:00 PM

My coach has already given me a month-long four day program. Basically, I do C&J or snatches, then clean or snatch pulls, then front or back squats, then an assistance exercise or two. I'm keeping the C&J and snatches light to work technique and because my shoulder's slightly injured, but I push the pulls a little harder and the squats and assistance exercises much harder.

I'd like to follow the program my coach has drawn up for me, so how would I integrate SS into it? Would I still do the SS squats, and just be squatting A LOT? Should I do SS the same day as my lifting days, or try to stagger them while taking a day of rest (this seems like I wouldn't get enough rest)?

My goal is to be dropped out of a plane to singlehandedly take out an invading alien force, a la the Hulk in the Marvel Ultimate universe. That would be pretty neat.

Jay Cohen 08-01-2008 07:16 PM

E;

A ship has one captain, if you have a coach, talk with him, do not mess with his programing. Discuss your goals and objectives, but when I was O training with a great coach, it was yes sir and no sir and if discovered doing other stuff, believe me, he was not a happy camper.

If your doing a three or four day strong O program, you really can't work in a SS day, period, or your O lifting will suffer.

Greg is the man on this, I'm sure he might chime in.

Greg Everett 08-01-2008 08:44 PM

I'm with Jay - You have a coach to be coached. If you want to coach yourself, coach yourself. If you don't trust your coach enough to follow his programming, you need to find a new coach. Otherwise, do what he says. You can of course bring your ideas to him, but give him the chance to explain why he's doing what he's doing before you decide it's not working for you.

Understand that it's not SS vs. Oly lifting. Oly training is by no stretch of the imagination devoid of strength work - it should contain plenty (and your description shows that your current program has enough). All SS will do is get your low-bar BS, press and DL up, and while it's generally successful, there's no guarantee. You'd still have to come back and work on making that new strength apply to the lifts - and don't fool youself - it's not that straightforward of an application.

SS is primarily for people with little or no strength work background and no idea of what they want to do with their newfound strength - if you know you want to apply strength to O-lifting, train as an O-lifter.

Emily Mattes 08-01-2008 08:59 PM

I definitely do not lack faith in my coach's programming. I'm just hit by the bug and want to more and more strength work--but if it's going to be detrimental to my training, then it's out of the question.


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