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-   -   IF and Anabolic Diet (http://www.catalystathletics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3867)

Brad Collins 02-13-2009 04:09 PM

IF and Anabolic Diet
 
I used to AD a while back and had pretty good results with it. Now that I'm IF'ing, I was wondering about combing the approaches. I usually fast for 19/5 or 20/4 each day, while switching up the times of the feeding window. I've lost some BF without being real strict on my diet.

Has anyone tried to combine these protocols? I know people combine IF and the Zone, IF and Paleo, but I haven't yet seen anything on the AD.

Derek Weaver 02-13-2009 06:59 PM

There's a thread in this sub forum, I think started by Joe Wagespauk (sp?). Check it out.

Brad Collins 02-13-2009 09:56 PM

Thanks, I'll look for it.

Donald Lee 02-13-2009 10:52 PM

I've been IFing and on the Anabolic diet for the past 2 weeks. I started a food log but got lazy. For the first 5 days, I did the initiation phase, then I carb loaded on the weekend. I only did 5 days because I'm already fairly fat adapted. After the first 2-3 days, I didn't feel hungry at all. I was logging all my food on FitDay during those first 5 days. I started off eating about 2,500 calories for maintenance. I eventually started dropping off closer to 2,200 calories. It's hard to shove that many calories down while IFing and keeping carbs < 30 g. You can't even eat much nuts or avocados because of their carb content. To get in more calories, oftentimes I'd sip on some sesame oil, olive oil, and grapeseed oil.

This week I started eating anywhere from 30-70 g of carbs per day. I stopped counting and measuring, because it's a pain in the arse. My carb threshhold is probably 30 g, but it's too much of a pain keeping it that low, so I aim for about no higher than 50-60 g a day. Even fish has a half gram of carbs for every gram of protein.

I've been IFing for a long time now, so I don't have any idea what effect combining it with the Anabolic Diet has. Last summer I was eating in this manner as well, but I probably ate closer to 100 - 150 g of carbs per day and I never did the initiation phase as I had not read the book at the time.

I've been monitoring my weight and body fat percentage:

1-30-9 140 lbs, 17.3% bodyfat

2-3-09 138 lbs, 16.6% bodyfat

2-4-09 137.6, 16.8% bodyfat

2-5-09 137.2, 16.6% bodyfat

weekend carb load

2-8-09 139.4, 16.4% bodyfat

2-10-09 139.2, 16.8% bodyfat

2-12-09 137.2, 16.2% bodyfat

2-13-09 138, 15.8% bodyfat

I was initially going to go through a mass gaining phase with this diet, but I have decided against it for now. I'm just eating as much as I feel like eating.

Brad Collins 02-13-2009 11:49 PM

Cool, thanks for the input.

Liam Dougherty Springer 02-16-2009 11:58 AM

In my experience there have been some down sides to going to extreem on the IF or AD when combineing the two including agitation and fat gain/ muscle loss....

I believe it is do to glycogen depletion and long fasts not being a very synergistic couple....

That being said I have found that when wanting the hormonal effects of cyclic carb loading and the bennifit of IF I can combine the two in a very synergistic mannor as long as any long fasts are done in the day or two post carb up and I add some fruit into the mix post workout and in my first and last meals. This will end up being a slightly higher percentage often times than a strict AD would require however fasting in my experience makes up for the increased carb intake.

There is some clinical evidence that would support this I believe haveing to do with fat addaptation and increased keton production even in a higher carb diet while IFing you could find links in some threads around here.... MODs' site is the place to go if you want to get into that stuff.

Brad Collins 02-16-2009 08:00 PM

Thanks, that's interesting.

I think I've decided to try more of a cyclical carb approach, where I would eat more protein with carbs from grains and fruit and strength training days, and protein with fat and vegetables on my metcon/off days. I would still get my EFA's and Fish oil every day.

I usually strength train 3 times a week, do metcon 3 times a week, and use Sundays as a rest day, or an active recovery day if I play basketball. My main goal right now is fat loss so I'll see how it works and adjust as necessary.

joe waguespack 08-03-2009 02:53 AM

I gave it a go a while back and really didn't see anything dramatic. Another thing I didn't like about the AD was once I decided to come off. I gained a good bit of bodyfat by introducing carbs back into my diet. I really never knew about SLOWLY introducing them back in, and it was detrimental to my physique. However, I did see amazing results by combining The Zone with IF. I figured out my Zone blocks and ate them all in a 4-5 hour window. That was , without a doubt, the best I ever felt and looked.

Mike ODonnell 08-03-2009 08:57 PM

Most people will go back to gaining fat without control over carbs (as we all don't carb binge solely on sweet potatoes....we know that).

Keep up the great work Joe!

Derek Weaver 08-07-2009 10:57 PM

Most people gain fat without control over carbs because they're not controlling other calories either. Refeeds don't slowly add carbs back in, and can have great upsides to the individual seeking body composition changes. Of course refeeds do tend to be at least somewhat calculated.

If someone is eating ~50% of their cals from fat with a say, 35% pro, 15% carb breakdown on 2000 cals/day, they'd be getting ~110 grams of fat, 175 grams pro, and 75 grams of carbs. Make the carbs and protein equal so the diet now looks like ~110 grams fat, 175 grams protein and 175 grams carbs (not anywhere near excessive for most athletes who do any glycolytic work) and you've got an extra 400 calories per day. Add in the water weight that each gram of carb. brings in (can't remember the number off the top of my head), and you can easily put a couple pounds on in a week. Yet, still less than 1 pound of fat, assuming energy balance is in a surplus.

Basically a long winded way of saying that if carbs go up, fat or protein need to come down. Preferably fat considering the benefits of increased protein intake.

Not meant to be an endorsement for high carb by any means, just making a point.


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