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Old 12-12-2006, 04:30 PM   #23
Pierre Auge
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Steve,
I am baffled that we are not on the same page here let me make my point this way: (Sorry this is going to end up on a wild tangent I know it)

Contact Athletes (MMA Fighter): - Avoiding Risk “broad example”
Statement - If you've never taken a punch, the first time you do it's going to be a complete shocker. If you continually avoid getting hit while training to be a fighter, once you do you're going to be unable to cope when your opponent is feeding them to you.

Point - This is my point on stress and I can think of one or more for each and every contact sport I've seen.

I am also a CQB/Tactical Shooting Instructor and can think of many in relation to combat whether that involves a LEO or Military scenario. Under duress your body has certain responses that you cannot train out, only individuals with pathological deficiencies do not have these responses and this is what makes them more dangerous than your non-pathological street cop. Drugs like PCP are great for inducing these pathological responses.

Hockey Players – Avoiding Risk
Statement- The human body does not particularly care what kind of stimulus it receives in my opinion. Whether you get hit by a car at 40mph, or a 250lbs defenseman at 40mph, you’re still getting hit by something bigger than you at 40mph. The induced trauma may be of different magnitudes but the stimulus itself for all your body cares is the same. A hockey player who is constantly avoiding the hits will not adapt to getting hit in the instant when he can’t do anything about it.

Point – You’re better off to suck it up tighten up the body and take the hit, you’ll take less damage.

Conditioning – Broad Statement
Statement- The fact is hi-rep hi-intensity snatches and clean & jerks suck in a broad systemic nature. They are some of the most taxing exercises you can do for repetition and this why they are great for soldiers and athletes alike. The skill required to maintain form and consistency at hi-rep is something that is invaluable to anyone who has to operate under stressful conditions. Completing the workout is stressful, playing any team or contact sport is stressful, combat is stressful.

Point – The only difference is the stressors and for an athlete these stressors are limited in their variability. For a soldier they are invariable, and I would argue this for everyone. Example: I had no idea I was going to get run over by a French guy delivering Chicken Wings driving a Ford Focus a little over 2 weeks ago. An athlete who trains only with simple and easy to learn techniques will be limited his application of complex motor skills. This is why gymnasts learn other sports more easily than other athletes because they are accustomed to complex motor patterns, everything else is simple as pie. Lifting at hi intensity has the same type of broad systemic effect on conditioning.

Coaches
Your Statement - Because there's reasonable doubt in my mind. Everyone "comes" to Crossfit, there are very few "home-grown". I'd say that XF can't take credit for a Robb Wolf, a Josh Everett, a Mark Twight, though I would come back and say that XF has definitely added something to their mixes, but the basic recipe had already been cooked up.

Point - I can’t argue with this and I don’t know why you brought it up but my intent was this: You are right coaches don’t win the game. But had the coach not been there the athlete would not have learned to play in the first place.

Statement – My initial statement: “A good coach shouldn't stand on competent athletes a good coach should produce competent athletes.” Should be interpreted as this – somewhere along the lines Robb Wolf, Josh Everett and Mark Twight were taught by someone how to perform their respective games without killing themselves. And once they were competent enough, they themselves were able to progress.

Point – We all learn from others, at no point have any of my ideas not been influenced by others. A coach influences his athletes and will be influenced by them. That same coach should not expect that each of his athletes are competent to begin with, he should ENSURE that they are competent before they attempt to progress. Such as this - before I put someone into an advanced live fire night shooting scenario, I will make damn sure they know how to safely aim the weapon and pull the trigger! Or before an athlete performs grace with prescribed weight, I will make damn sure they can do it with a broomstick, rebar, a 10lb training, bar, a women’s bar, a men’s bar so on and so forth.

Anyhow I’m a windbag.

Steve, I respect where you are coming from, I honestly like Neal have no idea where that is, but like you - I simply don't agree with it. And thats OK! I don't mind disagreeing as long as everyone realises that I'm right!!! That's a joke by the way haha.
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