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Old 09-04-2009, 06:54 AM   #12
Darryl Shaw
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 697
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Romano View Post
haha don't worry steven, already got my diet figured out...used to try and "cut" for bodybuilding purposes with the diet Darryl proposes, and I got skinny-fat. With Paleo, I have no such issues. Just like debating the theory, because it is so interesting that there are so many viewpoints.
Okay, first I should clarify that I'm not trying to propose any particular diet in this thread, I'm just thinking what if.......

Second you say that you eat "paleo" but could you clarify what you mean by that? The reason I ask is because when I say paleo diet I'm referring specifically to the foods and nutrition of paleolithic hominids in Africa 50,000+ years ago but many others, particulary on the Crossfit boards, seem to have a different ideas about what that means.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Romano View Post
And Darryl, those studies just support the fact that our ancestors consumed root veggies....not that they consumed grains or legumes or any non-paleo food, or that they limited their intake of meat.
I didn't suggest that paleo man limited his meat intake however I would suggest that his environment restricted his meat intake along with the propensity for his intended meat intake to run away whenever possible and this placed a natural limit on meat consumption and of course animal fat intakes would be low because wild game on the African continent is extremely lean. If memory serves in Deadly Harvest by Geoff Bond the author states that the average daily meat intake of the !kung san is ~150g/day and total animal soure foods are ~225g/d, equivalent to one medium to large steak per day in other words, and this relatively small amount of animal source foods would more than meet daily protein requirements even without the protein provided by the considerable amount of mongongo nuts and other plant foods eaten daily.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Romano
Also, evidence that diseases of civilization are gone when there is enough food to go around? I cannot remember this being covered in a SINGLE anthro class. No, agriculture generally equated to health problems, regardless of the individual circumstances.
I disagree, there are many examples of thriving rural agriculture based societies throughout history on all continents that did fine as long as there was sufficient food to go around with Japan and Okinawa specifcally being a perfect examples. of this

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Romano
Finally, in the last paragraph or so, you mention that you don't really believe that humans cannot eat grain without health issues, and that 10,000 years might be enoug to evolve out of it....but then you say that we must disregard the diets of the hunter gatherers the 30000 years before that, because we have not evolved enough! While I do dispute the dates you listed, please clarify your reasoning here....
The reason I'm starting to rethink the issue of grains in human health is because grains are merely one of the more recently introduced sources of starchy carbohydrates in our diet. Starch has played a central role in the diets of hominids for many hundreds of thousands of years, even Chimps dig up and eat root and tubers (link), so there's nothing uniquely human about this trait, it's a primate thing. What's unique about humans though is our ability to exploit and thrive on wide variety of starchy carbohydrates and it's this adaptability that's been central to our success as a species not our ability to hunt meat or find reliable sources of dietary fats.

How does this relate to the Tarahumara diet then? Well clearly theirs is a starch based diet that's low in fat and animal protein and although the type of starch consumed is different from that eaten by paleolithic hunter-gatherers in Africa 50,000+ years ago that may be irrelevant because they're simply following a dietary pattern that's been the norm for our species throughout most of our history ie. plant based, high in starchy carbohydrates with low but adequate amounts of animal protein and fats.
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