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Old 12-05-2010, 01:51 AM   #17
Derek Weaver
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,628

Originally Posted by Andrew Midmer View Post
From a recent lalonde seminar he basically said 30% protein, 60% fat, 10% cho. His science behind it was very impressive. I can't see how the premise that: kcals in - kcals out = weight gain/loss. There's more to it.
I don't know Lalonde, and won't attack him or his specific practices, but I've never seen any science in favor of a) percentages, b) fat intake having to be that high for any reason.

Most of the studies that support that type of an approach are faulty at best. People noting that they lose more weight on a low carb diet are usually doing a few things:
- Unintentionally lowering caloric intake through the restriction of carbohydrate.
- Not actually losing much past the initial phase of a few weeks. Depleting carbohydrate/glycogen stores is going to result in a pretty big loss of water. It's easy to lose 5-6 lbs in a week, even for a small person, when first restricting carbohydrate. the weight loss then either flattens out, or stops.
- Aren't done under metabolic ward conditions.

I'm not saying low carb is bad, but assigning ketogenic diet percentages for speedy fat loss has several flaws. One being that it's not required for health or fat loss. There was no singular paleo diet, I believe it's a cop out to say that Asians do better on carbs because they're carb adapted Asians. Asians do better at not getting fat because they usually don't eat as much as us.

Originally Posted by Justin Arnold View Post
So, have any "truths" about mass-gain on a ketogenic diet?
Like Arien said, CKDs are best if the need to be ketogenic is present. Carbs are required for decent performance. Cycling them can ease the psychological burden for most.

Trying to get enough volume to grow, with the absence of carbs can be a real problem. The "bonk" comes much faster, and then people note that they can't handle volume. I actually thought that until I started eating ~2x the carbs I was eating before. Now, I've made it through a relatively high stress and high volume program for 3/4 starting the final 4 week block tomorrow, and I've had no real issues to note.

Last note on for this long winded post:
- Often people like to point to Gary Taubes as debunking the idea that calories don't matter. That somehow, humans, but no other animals, are exempt from the laws of thermodynamics. There are certainly some populations that are going to have extenuating circumstances that make this closer to true. People with thyroid conditions would be an example

In the end though, it's about eating less. Eat Stop Eat is an effective intermittent fasting approach because it wipes out 1-2 days worth of food from the diet.

Why do people feel like calories don't really count, but when they want to gain weight, the answer is always "eat more"?

I said it in another thread just a second ago, but the issue isn't anti- low carb diets. Or anti- high carb diets. It's anti the wrong diet given the individual and the situation.
And if you don't think kettleball squat cleans are difficult, I say, step up to the med-ball
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