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Old 02-28-2007, 10:58 AM   #1
Steve Shafley
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Default Rambling about mobility, or DROM work

I've been doing more mobility work, either in the form of routines similar to Maxwell's, Sonnon's WW, or Tsatsouline's Super Joints or Resilient.

It makes me feel "better" than if I didn't do it. I would really like to check out the Magnificent Mobility and Inside-Out products to see what they are saying, but can't bring myself to buy them right now.

One thing, though, that stands out.

The listed routines, i.e. Maxwell's Joint Mobility and Recharge, and Sonnon's Warrior Wellness, and to a lesser extent, Pavel's material, work from the top down, starting with your head and ending with your feet (edited to say "feet")

I've never quite understood why. For me, it makes sense to start at the extremities, the hands and feet and head, and work your way inward, or even in the middle and work your way out.

The feet, in particular, are often de-emphasized, except in the WW routines. I think this is a mistake, as ankle mobility and stability has a direct impact on the knees and hips, and I wouldn't neglect taking the toes through the ROM they are capable of performing.

My re-ordered DROM "Outside-In" stuff looks more like this:

head -> fingers/wrists -> toes/ankles

elbows -> shoulders



Going from the core out:

hips core spine




The other thought is how to add prehab movements and/or postural correction movements into the mix, since I think the core of a DROM routine should be pain-free joint movements.

So, DROM -> Prehab/Postural Correction -> Dynamic warm ups/movement prep

Any thoughts or comments on this?

I know that many of you have seen the stuff I haven't.
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Old 02-28-2007, 01:00 PM   #2
Yael Grauer
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Originally Posted by Steve Shafley View Post
The feet, in particular, are often de-emphasized, except in the WW routines. I think this is a mistake, as ankle mobility and stability has a direct impact on the knees and hips, and I wouldn't neglect taking the toes through the ROM they are capable of performing.
Here's a quote from Eric Cressey's latest newsletter:
For those who couldn't make it, here's an interesting aside. I evaluated six people at the seminar who had various aches and pains in their lower body, and of the six, four were severely lacking in ankle mobility. Coincidence? I think not. Get to training more barefoot and doing more ankle mobility work while taping your ankles less and getting rid of your high-top sneakers, high-heels, and any other shoe that dramatically elevates your heels. You'll feel like a million bucks in no time.
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Old 02-28-2007, 06:31 PM   #3
Greg Everett
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the proximal -> distal order makes the most sense to me i think (yes, i intentionally avoided saying core to extremity) only because of generating warmth... that said, i can see the distal -> proximal being better because it's easy to neglect the ankles/wrists/feet/hands because they're such a pain in the ass (bad analogy in this case, I guess), so performing them first will more likely result in more attention and better work.

on the barefoot thing... right on in the absence of big loading since pretty much everyone i've run into has some kind of arch deficiency, and some are like me with fully collapsing ankles, so loading without support = 15 pounds of fudged up all the way up the legs and into the back at least.
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Old 02-28-2007, 07:50 PM   #4
Steve Shafley
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Yeah, it's all probably 6 one way, half dozen the other.

Why all the fucked up feet?

I've been doing more and more training barefoot. Of course, this is because basically I'm lazy and don't want to put on shoes in my basement gym. Soon, when it warms up, I'll just be training in tighty whiteys.

Look out for that vblog.
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Old 03-01-2007, 05:59 AM   #5
Allen Yeh
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Cool topic I hope more people chime in. My 2 cents:

I don't have a whole lot of depth in this subject as I've only seen and read 1 or 2 things in each category.

Joint mobility - Pavels Super Joints
Prehab/movement Prep:
-2 Core Performance books
-The New Rules of Lifting has a movement prep routine also
-Eric Cressey, Bill Hartman and Mike Robertsons different articles on T-nation and respective websites ( I would say this falls under all 3 categories?)

If I had the money availible I'd love to buy Magnificent Mobility, Inside/Out and possilby even the Z-Health stuff.

I guess I've always done it in this order more because I never though about doing it in any other order:

1. movement prep type stuff to serve as part of my warmup
2. joint mobility
3. Prehab stuff

I typically would only do 2/3 on training days but on a rest day like today I'm planning on going through all 3. I guess my joints are so messed up that I felt any pain doing it in the order I described and I definitely feel like the movement prep stuff is "easier" than the prehab stuff.

when I think movement prep I think of things like:
hip crossover
lunge w/twist
hand walks
dragon walks (old martial arts term but I can't remember the actual name)
inverterd hamstring walk

When I think of prehab I think of things like:
Prone trap raises
x-band walks
face pulls
glute bridging
front/side planks
band dislocates (though I guess this could be joint mobility as well)

In reference to joint mobility:
I think the top down method (partly) is for you to remember easily if you don't have the book/list in front of you. When you run PT in the Army that's the easiest way not to "miss" a movement. Rather than skipping around and possibly missing something.

So top down looks something like this:
neck ->shoulders -> wrists -> hands ->spine ->hips -> knees -> ankles -> feet

With the approach you outlined it'd be easier to miss one if reciting from memory?

Where do you lump band traction in with? I've been doing it as my post workout thing kind of lumped in with joint mobility though I know in the Dave Tate article he does it pre-workout.
"And for crying out loud. Don't go into the pain cave. I can't stress this enough. Your Totem Animal won't be in there to help you. You'll be on your own. The Pain Cave is for cowards.
Pain is your companion, don't go hide from it."
-Kelly Starrett
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Old 03-01-2007, 06:51 AM   #6
JW Luckett
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Thought it was:

head & shoulders-knees & toes-knees & toes (repeat)
eyes & ears & mouth & nose
head & shoulders-knees & toes-knees & toes

could be wrong

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