Home   |   Contact   |   Help

Get Our Newsletter
Sign up for our free newsletter to get training tips and stay up to date on Catalyst Athletics, and get a FREE issue of the Performance Menu journal.

Go Back   Catalyst Athletics Forums > Community > Community & Events

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-10-2010, 10:34 AM   #101
Andrew Wilson
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
Posts: 1,140
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Low View Post
This is not exactly correct.

Glycolysis turns on maximally above lactate threshold.

Below lac threshold you're using oxidative phosphorylation as the main energy source.

So if you jog for 3 minutes after 100m sprint, glycolysis is turned on somewhat (but not maximally) while mitochondria are replacing the oxygen debt + providing energy for the jog.

------------------------------

The delusion of the energy curves is that each of the contributions of energy are used in that specific order. It's actually almost a reverse order in which they are used.

Aerobic is the prominent resource used during any low intensity activity.

Current ATP stores, PCr, and a bit of glycolysis accounts for some of the lag time between ramping up activity and distribution of oxygen/CO2 to/from the cardiovascular system to the muscles.

Glycolysis is never maximally stimulated unless above lac threshold; thus, the majority of energy contributions below lac threshold are always from aerobic sources (e.g. oxidative phosphorylation in mitochondria).

The energy curves look drastically different for maximal intensity exercise vs. lac threshold vs. walking/slow jogging.

----------------------------

This is also why a lot of Clyde Hart's stuff for 400m utilizes multiple repeats of sub-lac 200m which ramp up intensity building up into the track season. At first you're building primarily aerobic base with them. As the intensity during starts to ramp up during teh season, you still get the aerobic base component + some lac training. Then nearer to major competition you're maintaining the aerobic base + developing the lactate endurance you need to finish strong.

Building up aerobic base (for races longer than 25-30s) especially 400m which is 60/40 anaerobic/aerobic (50/50 for women) is important because aerobic can easily accomodate more adaptation and thus more energy to power running (2 ATP vs 34 ATP). The higher the energy storage in muscles via myoglobin + cardiorespiratory adaptations you don't get as much from as from sprinting alone encourages a broader aerobic base upon which to build a foundation for the more intense lactic training needed to finish off a 400m sprint.

In other words, the greater percentage of your Vo2max that you can go without going above lac threshold, the faster you can run 400m or beyond. Elite endurance athletes can go up around 80-85% VO2max without going above lac threshold.

Thus, why 400m is primarily a combination of 3 types of training:
~Increasing strength and application of through plyometrics
~Increasing maximal sprinting speed through training form and short sprints (0-80m)
~Building aerobic base (off season/preseason) and then adapting into training lac threshold (in season)

This translates to....

1. Increase speed (via sprinting mechanics + strength/plyo).
2. Increase % of Vo2max you can run at without going above lac thresh = increased speed endurance (aerobic base... slower 200m repeats in Hart's coaching)
3. Develop lac threshold tolerance to finish race (supra lac threshold training via usually increased intensity of HIIT -- faster 200m repeats in Hart's coaching)
...
Andrew Wilson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2010, 10:49 AM   #102
Andrew Wilson
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
Posts: 1,140
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoffrey Thompson View Post
It's been a while since I clicked through that link. Man, it's a horror show there. Just count the rhabdo cases in the last month. Madness.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CrossFit Journal View Post
Universally scalable program has been proven sound
Quote:
Originally Posted by CrossFit Journal View Post
Experts offering fitness, nutrition, or health regimens that they claim are distilled from first principles rather than clinical practice are fooling those who listen to them and, as often as not, themselves as well
Andrew Wilson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2010, 11:45 AM   #103
John P. Walsh
Member
 
John P. Walsh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 78
Default

Oh how the Kool Aid has soured! Remember me before it was cool to hate @fit? LULZ!












http://moynihaninstitute.com/
John P. Walsh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2010, 06:32 PM
Andrew Wilson
This message has been deleted by Andrew Wilson.
Old 12-11-2010, 01:32 AM   #104
Derek Weaver
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,642
Default

That's a legendary post
__________________
Quote:
And if you don't think kettleball squat cleans are difficult, I say, step up to the med-ball
- CJ Kim
Derek Weaver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2010, 07:37 AM   #105
Jon Pechette
New Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 34
Default

What's the general consensus on Gant's Hybrid? I know this may be slightly off topic, but I'm pretty new to these forums (been browsing them for a while, though) and I was wondering if the problem that most people here have with CF is with CFHQ or with CrossFit methods or only with some of CF's methods.

I think that there is no way that a person can develop elite levels of strength with CF alone (pulling heavy singles a few times a year producing a 500+ pound deadlift? That's a load of crap). I do like the conditioning aspect, though (if you remove less-useful movements: SDHP for example). Right now I'm doing something very similar to Gant's Hybrid program: 5/3/1 with short, heavy metcons, and extra running (usually 400m repeats). It's very planned out (exact opposite of the CF mainpage) with the workouts focused around assisting the main lift. Recovery is very important (I don't go 100% all the time, especially on the deload weeks). I've been seeing great gains and I've PR'd in almost everything the last couple of months (OL, PL, CF benchmarks, rowing, running, sprints and longer efforts).

That was longer post than I thought it was going to be, I feel like it should be a new thread...sorry :/

Last edited by Jon Pechette : 12-11-2010 at 07:38 AM. Reason: typo
Jon Pechette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2010, 04:13 PM   #106
Don Stevenson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 502
Default

Don't try and get this thread back onto serious training discussion, it's too far off the tracks for that.

Andrew, nice work!
Don Stevenson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-11-2010, 11:56 PM   #107
Derek Weaver
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,642
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Pechette View Post
What's the general consensus on Gant's Hybrid? I know this may be slightly off topic, but I'm pretty new to these forums (been browsing them for a while, though) and I was wondering if the problem that most people here have with CF is with CFHQ or with CrossFit methods or only with some of CF's methods.

I think that there is no way that a person can develop elite levels of strength with CF alone (pulling heavy singles a few times a year producing a 500+ pound deadlift? That's a load of crap). I do like the conditioning aspect, though (if you remove less-useful movements: SDHP for example). Right now I'm doing something very similar to Gant's Hybrid program: 5/3/1 with short, heavy metcons, and extra running (usually 400m repeats). It's very planned out (exact opposite of the CF mainpage) with the workouts focused around assisting the main lift. Recovery is very important (I don't go 100% all the time, especially on the deload weeks). I've been seeing great gains and I've PR'd in almost everything the last couple of months (OL, PL, CF benchmarks, rowing, running, sprints and longer efforts).

That was longer post than I thought it was going to be, I feel like it should be a new thread...sorry :/
What you're doing isn't anywhere close to CF. Gant's Hybrid was and still is a good way to set up a combination of conditioning and weight training.

What you're doing right now is really no different than what a lot of successful coaches do for their athletes.

In general, if you get stronger, you will PR most of the CF workouts.
__________________
Quote:
And if you don't think kettleball squat cleans are difficult, I say, step up to the med-ball
- CJ Kim
Derek Weaver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2010, 12:04 PM   #108
Andrew Wilson
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
Posts: 1,140
Default



Glassman plagiarizing Supertraining, and Crossfit L1 cert is the same price as 3 USTF certications, 2 USAW cert with left overs
Page 31 from Supertraining (Siff Verkhoshansky 1999, 4th edition):
Andrew Wilson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2010, 12:44 PM   #109
Arien Malec
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,035
Default

Glassman: "We've repeatedly and publicly challenged the exercise science community to name a single major contribution to sport coming from their ranks - steroids don't count!"
Arien Malec is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-12-2010, 02:36 PM   #110
Geoffrey Thompson
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 227
Default

Goro. Wow. That was a master stroke.
Geoffrey Thompson is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:38 AM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.6.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Subscribe to our Newsletter


Receive emails with training tips, news updates, events info, sale notifications and more.
ASK GREG

Submit your question to be answered by Greg Everett in the Performance Menu or on the website

Submit Your Question
WEIGHTLIFTING TEAM

Catalyst Athletics is a USA Weightlifting team of competitive Olympic-style weightlifters with multiple national team medals.

Read More
Olympic Weightlifting Book
Catalyst Athletics
Contact Us
About
Help
Newsletter
Products & Services
Gym
Store
Seminars
Weightlifting Team
Performance Menu
Magazine Home
Subscriber Login
Issues
Articles
Workouts
About the Program
Workout Archives
Exercise Demos
Text Only
Instructional Content
Exercise Demos
Video Gallery
Free Articles
Free Recipes
Resources
Recommended Books & DVDs
Olympic Weightlifting Guide
Discussion Forum
Weight Conversion Calculator