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Old 01-26-2011, 01:43 PM   #21
Charlie Vassallo
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First, thanks for all the responses and help thus far.

Now, I just wanted to explain a few things.

I do two long runs a week and they fall in place with me getting to the gym.

The other days, I usually just walk there or run there (no detour - 15 - 25 minutes) depending on what route I take.

On the days I don't have a long run my routine goes like this.

5/3/1
Strength
Assistance
Prowler/Sled or WOD

Now about foods. I don't like to eat grains and am not a huge fan of pasta so that's no problem. I can do without breads except for on Sunday when I like to eat a few pieces. I enjoy sweet potatoes, squash and have been incorporating that into my diet more often. I have no need to worry about junk as I'm not really into that unless its a cheat day. As for other foods, i enjoy the paleo/primal way but will start to incorporate other foods as mentioned.

I think I'm having such a hard time losing the last little bit, because I'm simply just not eating enough with the amount of activity I'm doing.

I just want to be sure I'm eating enough for recovery and performance and be able to avoid some dumb injury because I'm lacking nutrients.
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Old 01-26-2011, 02:46 PM   #22
Derek Weaver
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Charlie, I answered each one of your questions. So did just about everyone else.

You've already explained your training schedule, and it's a fairly high volume of training. Strength for what I'm guessing is 4 days/week w/ 5/3/1 (that's fine), assistance, Prowler or sled or WOD (most around here would say ditch the WOD. I won't argue with them) Plus, 2 runs and what sounds like a lot of NEPA since you also walk to the gym when you're not running there. A total of 6 conditioning/cardio workouts, 4 strength workouts and a lot of Non Exercise Physical Activity. You eat too little and you're training too much.

RULE: the higher your training volume, the smaller your deficit. No other discussion necessary.

You sound determined, and I want to see you succeed. Go get it, adjust as necessary, listen to your body.
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Old 01-26-2011, 03:16 PM   #23
Charlie Vassallo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek Weaver View Post
Charlie, I answered each one of your questions. So did just about everyone else.

You've already explained your training schedule, and it's a fairly high volume of training. Strength for what I'm guessing is 4 days/week w/ 5/3/1 (that's fine), assistance, Prowler or sled or WOD (most around here would say ditch the WOD. I won't argue with them) Plus, 2 runs and what sounds like a lot of NEPA since you also walk to the gym when you're not running there. A total of 6 conditioning/cardio workouts, 4 strength workouts and a lot of Non Exercise Physical Activity. You eat too little and you're training too much.

RULE: the higher your training volume, the smaller your deficit. No other discussion necessary.

You sound determined, and I want to see you succeed. Go get it, adjust as necessary, listen to your body.
Thank You for the help.

Will play with the macro/micro-nutrients and see how it goes.

I just now need to hammer down the post workout meal and i'll be good to go.
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Old 01-27-2011, 10:44 AM   #24
Blair Lowe
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Have you looked into the data that says that fat burning is optimal after waking up. Basically it states, you should stay in this fasted zone for 1-2 hours, possibly doing fasted cardio. Yes, it's slow and long but it's easy to recover from. Think brisk walking or jogging. Something light to just burn some calories.
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Old 01-27-2011, 12:06 PM   #25
Grissim Connery
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i don't think anybody asked this:

do you want to lose weight for performance (assuming bodyweight exercise performance), a weight class, or to look good?
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Old 01-27-2011, 12:44 PM   #26
Derek Weaver
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i don't think anybody asked this:

do you want to lose weight for performance (assuming bodyweight exercise performance), a weight class, or to look good?
It doesn't matter. The methods of doing so are the same regardless of doing a handstand, making a weight class, losing the "non functional weight" (fat), or to see the abz.

Eat less, move a little more. Rinse, repeat. Only pull out the tricks like morning fasted cardio etc. once progress stalls and such tricks become necessary. Getting to 10% shouldn't require such tricks and could be counter productive with all of his current activity.
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Old 01-27-2011, 02:13 PM   #27
John Alston
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Disagree Derke - It does matter b/c that's going to determine what kind of focus one can do. If you need to drop a weight class to compete in a sport, you're going to have to be careful you don't compromise your performance.
If you want to show some abz and don't care about performance, then you will have other options not available to the above competitor example.
When I hear about getting serious about losing an amount of fat, my mind goes to lifting, walking and diet control - the kind of thing that wouldn't work on Charlie's hyper schedule, but would work for me since I'd be willing to sacrifice somethings like "conditioning."
So Chuck - fat loss, strength, conditioning, all that crap - I think it's too many foci. Fat loss and maybe one other for a bit would be my 2 cents.
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Old 01-27-2011, 02:32 PM   #28
Derek Weaver
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Regardless, the principles still do in fact, hold true.

Eat less, move a little more. Fat loss is fat loss.

If it's someone who is looking for performance, his training volume is going to be a little higher than someone who just wants to look good. In which case the point that Darryl made, and then I made as well, that the caloric deficit needs to be smaller is the general principle to remember.

Someone who wants to get a little abby for the hell of it (nothing wrong with that), can do something more like the walking, lifting and eating much less ( a whole lot less, like a PSMF/V Diet thing). An extreme deficit with a high volume of training would be a poor choice. I speak from experience on that one.

Either way, the principles are still the same with the application shifting.

OP has said he's got a crazy training schedule that he seems to like and want to maintain as best as he can. I agree that he's chasing too many rabbits, but he's said he likes his WOD, needs to run for whatever reason, and I'm not going to tell someone who is after fat loss to stop lifting, and 5/3/1 is a decent approach since intensity is modulated by the set up. So, small deficits, with disciplined training deloads and diet breaks become the basic template given his situation.

Where is the disagreement?
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And if you don't think kettleball squat cleans are difficult, I say, step up to the med-ball
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Old 01-27-2011, 02:56 PM   #29
Arien Malec
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek Weaver View Post
I agree that he's chasing too many rabbits, but he's said he likes his WOD, needs to run for whatever reason, and I'm not going to tell someone who is after fat loss to stop lifting, and 5/3/1 is a decent approach since intensity is modulated by the set up. So, small deficits, with disciplined training deloads and diet breaks become the basic template given his situation.

Where is the disagreement?
I think we are all saying the same thing. Charlie would be more successful chasing fewer rabbits for a while. Concentrate on fat loss for 10-12 weeks, scale down to lifting and walking 2-3x/week, hit the fat loss goal, and return to the conditioning goals at that point.

If he doesn't want to do that, he needs to accept a lower deficit and concomitant slower rate of fat loss, or accept bad things (under-recovery, strength loss, worsened performance, etc).
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Old 01-27-2011, 05:27 PM   #30
Grissim Connery
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i ask b/c i see time as a limiting factor.

balancing sport training, strength, and conditioning is a time burden. i just feel that if you're already putting plenty of time into conditioning and you aren't seeing the fat loss, then either you're at your good performance weight, or you need to take time from the others and specifically work at fat loss.

on the other hand, long ass LSD may improve your conditioning for the better, so maybe you'll get a performance boost anyways.

but if you just want to look good, put your time wherever it needs to go
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