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Old 04-20-2007, 09:46 AM   #21
Dave Van Skike
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I think it depends on the individual. Lots of people have fairly good technique naturally (especially if they are not overweight). I think concentrating on relaxing, been up on your toes and falling forward are worthwhile. I'm not sure you need to put tons of work into this though - it's really just running how your body is designed to after all. Like I said I think the whole thing goes out the window if you're wearing boots and carrying weights.

Dave I wonder whether technical improvements cause greater efficiency in running or cycling? My instinct is that getting as close to a perfect circle in your cycling stroke will cause a massive increase in speed - however I don't cycle so this may be rubbish.

So I think POSE/CHI/running well are valuable if used in conjunction with running training. I don't think it's enough (in Allen's case) on it's own. And like I said add webbing, pack, rifle and a helmet and try to run POSE and it's just not happening for the majority of people.
It's intersting but I think the whole pedal in circles thing is overrated. Real fast efficent pedaling (on the road) has more to do with being able to quickly contract and relax the pedaling muscles-meaning---
a fluid but powerful stroke with a definte power pulse.

Mountain biking is fairly different, where a powerful stroke at max speed may cause you to break traction----traction equals speed, wheelspin equals stop.

That's one of the reason you find that elite mountain bikers have a fairly smooth pedal stroke but may not produce the same max wattage as a track cyclist who rides in an environement of optimum traction. Massive increases in speed over the short distance (other than a flat out sprint) usually don't result from just form, but good form will allow you to maintain speed in truly huge way.

This is part experience and part bias. As a semi-hammerhead, I have realized that all speed, all strength all performance really comes from technical mastery.....strengh is a technical skill, speed is a technical skill, endurance is a technical skill. etc...

With running, maybe we're talking about the same thing. your form needs to be good enough to relax every part of your body that is not directly assisting the movement- quiet upper body, minimmal tension to maintain a solid core, "springy" legs, loose ankles etc.
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Old 04-20-2007, 10:04 AM   #22
Josh Whiting
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With running, maybe we're talking about the same thing. your form needs to be good enough to relax every part of your body that is not directly assisting the movement- quiet upper body, minimimal tension to maintain a solid core, "springy" legs, loose ankles etc.
I couldn't agree more with this and I think it is what makes tempo running so effective, learning to stay relaxed while you are exerting yourself. The relaxing part can quite easily go out the window when you are pushing things at 100%.
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Old 04-21-2007, 07:29 AM   #23
JW Luckett
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James,

Thanks for the program. I was this close to giving up running entirely. Absolutley loathe it. But at the same time I have this weird desire to be good at it, perhaps to even like it a bit, if that's not asking too much.

I like the layout of this program, and we finally had a fairly warm, sunny day after too many months of snow and cold, so I changed my mind. I will give these 20 sessions a fair and honest shot. If it doesn't work out, I am finished with running anything other than sprints for the rest of my life, so let that be on your conscience.

Today I jogged 15 minutes according to the Intellectual Property of James Evans, Super Generous Guy (SGG). Twasn't too bad.

-jw
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Old 04-22-2007, 07:17 AM   #24
Allen Yeh
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So I went before the board this weekend and I feel pretty confident about it. I didn't hear anything I didn't already know in terms of schedule. I won't hear anythign about my commision for 3-4 months and I can go to training as early as Oct' 07 that's about 6 months from now.

James,

If one hasn't been running very consistently right now would it be fine to kind of stay in the 1-3 for the first 2 weeks?

Thanks for everyone's input it's been very helpful I was somewhat panicked at first when I read about an "easy 5 miles" and I feel a lot better about it now.
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Old 04-23-2007, 09:29 AM   #25
James Evans
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Fallen behind bit over the weekend and been in court all day.

Allen,

Listen to your body. Don't overdo things but at the same time don't overestimate your own ability. Sometimes I'm absolutely trashed and have to stop after 10 minutes. Other times I'm just being lazy.

But I would keep the frequency down at first. The whole point of this is graduation.

JW,

Good luck. I could post some guff about deadlifting 600lbs but it would be an outright lie or theft from somewhere else. I wrote this programme for myself and have followed it through 3-4 times (sometimes after long periods of heavy workload I just go back to the start again so I don't go out and wreck myself running). This has worked for me. But it is my programme pretty much exactly save that you can't replicate my benchmark runs and I would say that some room for experimentation is totally viable.

Dave,

Just read your post before I left for the weekend on Friday and gave it a lot of thought on the train.

I would like to say 'no' running should be the most natural thing, look at children. I guess that's the romantic answer. Sadly, I see people out and about with the weirdest technique (I have to say a lot of woman run badly - the weak abductor/adducter argument? Can't remember which and just plain damn sloppy running). So yes, some work with a proper coach is going to be beneficial to anyone just as seeing a proper swimming coach will work wonders and being taught to ride a bike efficiently is going to make you a better riders.

On the subject of bikes, loads of people I see need to be sorted out, mainly for their set up which is appalling (seat too low, handlebars wrong etc.) or overgearing.

Sorry, rushing this.
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Old 05-02-2007, 11:39 AM   #26
Allen Yeh
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Good news:
400m PR of 1:29 my best before this was 1:31 a while ago.

Bad news:
I really want to get started on this program but I keep getting so discouraged whenever I go out and am unable to complete 15 minutes straight. I feel like I'm just unable to govern my pace when I'm running on the road. Previous to the past few weeks I'd been doing all my running on a treadmill. I'm possibly going to invest into a pedometer or something to kind of give me a general idea of how fast I am going.
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Old 05-02-2007, 12:26 PM   #27
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Allen, just reel yourself in. I know that's hard but you want to be taking the opposite of the CrossFit 'wham bam thank you mam' approach. I don't want you to walk but if you have to shuffle like an 80 year old so be it.

You'll get your pace up on the intervals.
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Old 05-02-2007, 04:58 PM   #28
JW Luckett
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Allen,

You could try using a metronome. I sometimes use a little digital one my kids don't need anymore. It goes beep beep.

Decide your tempo and then match your foot strikes to the beep. Actually pretty hard to do, especially on variable terrain, so I usually just get the tempo set in my head before I start.

-jw
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Old 05-03-2007, 02:56 AM   #29
Allen Yeh
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I don't want you to walk but if you have to shuffle like an 80 year old so be it.
That's what I was afraid you'd say. I've been really focusing on my running form (POSE type /non heel first running) and I noticed whenever I'd go slower it was harder to keep that form and it devolved into the shuffle method.
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"And for crying out loud. Don't go into the pain cave. I can't stress this enough. Your Totem Animal won't be in there to help you. You'll be on your own. The Pain Cave is for cowards.
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-Kelly Starrett
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Old 05-03-2007, 03:57 AM   #30
Josh Whiting
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Allen,

You need to stop trying to force results. All you need to do is go out and get the miles in while not stressing about how fast you are going. I promise you before you know it you'll be thinking "I'm actually quite enjoying this" and covering the ground at a good pace.
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