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Old 06-04-2007, 02:07 PM   #1
Mike Kirkpatrick
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Default A few random IF questions from a newb

Whatsup guys? This is my first post here, and so far I have found this site to be filled with great information. Anyway, I am completely new to the whole intermittent fasting concept, as I have never even heard of it before. It seems to be a very interesting idea, and something I might be interested in starting (using the fast-5 plan) if I knew a little more about it. Ok, before the questions, here are some stats about me:

Age: 17 (I'm young, lol)
Height: 6-1"
Weight: 195lbs
Bodyfat%: 16.25
Goal bodyfat%: 10.00

My workout program is basically powerlifting on M/W/F using I believe what is the conjugate method, doing high intensity conditioning (either GPP, sprints, or guerilla cardio) on Tue/Thur, and MMA (1 hour MT, 1 hour BJJ/Wrestling) usually 2-3 days a week. So, as you can see my workload is pretty high (but nothing spectacular). I've been following John Berardi's Precision Nutrition and his 7 habits, but I find it extremely hard to always eat correctly, especially when I am away from my house.

Now, the questions (sorry guys, there a alot):

1) Is it possible for me to avoid Overtraining if I follow IF/Fast-5 with my training schedule?

2) What types of foods should I be eating during my eating periods? I am not famaliar with paleo foods honestly.

3) If I follow the Fast-5, how much food should I be eating during my 5 hour eating period? Is there a caloric limit?

4) Is it possible to continue to improve my S&C and my MMA while doing this?

5) I don't plan on being super religious with this (I may even eat regularly on the weekends), so should I take any pre/post workout drinks/meals before or after S&C and MMA? I usually do my S&C in the AM, and MMA in the PM.

6) How do you explain your diet/eating plan to your family or friends? It sounds so gimmicky and extreme, I can see my family thinking I'm crazy, lol.

I am very interested in hearing from Rob Wolf, he seems very knowledgable in MMA/training athletes, but I would greatly appreciate answers from anyone. Thanks in advance for any answers.
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Old 06-04-2007, 02:38 PM   #2
Robb Wolf
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Hey Mike!
Welcome...holly boatload of questions BatMan! In a nutshell...yes, one can implement intermittent fasting successfully into a strength & Conditioning/MMA program. It is HIGHLY recommended that one can put together a good paleo/zone diet built around a normal eating schedule first. Basically cleaning up the diet and getting consistency. From there compressing the feeding window (like the fast-5) is a good option. Track down the post from Dr. Eades regarding IF, it is outstanding. Issues 6 and 16 (I think) cover IF. Worth a read for sure. Sift through these threads as there is a mountain of good information.

Somewhat related here is an endorsement from some MMA fighters from Ireland I believe pertaining to Cordain's Paleo Diet:
http://thepaleodiet.com/success_stories/#athletes

I think intermittent fasting can be highly beneficial but it is a bit like jumping into the deep end of the pool...ease into some of the paleo nutrition, then add some IF.

Keep us posted on how things are going!
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Old 06-04-2007, 02:51 PM   #3
Ron Nelson
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Hey Robbo,
Is it a good idea to do an IF at such a young age? 6'1", 195 isn't exactly pudgy. I think the BF calcs may be high, no?

Nonetheless, Mike, listen to the Wolf.
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Old 06-04-2007, 10:05 PM   #4
Mike Kirkpatrick
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Robb, thanks for the info. I plan on buying the Protein Power Life Plan soon, since I saw you recommending it in the paleo forum. What kind of adherence would you say I need to be hitting with the paleo diet before I should start worrying about IF? My only concern about IF is this: I am starting to compete in a good bit of grappling tourneys (my first one is this month on the 9th, then I have another on the 23rd), so I will be doing alot of training in technique, strength, conditioning, flexibility, etc...and to me, as someone who is not famaliar with Intermittent Fasting, it looks like there is no way I could eat enough nutrients to enable my to not only enable recovery, but also continue to improve at a high rate. Have you ever trained any athletes who uses IF?

Ron, my bodyfat calculation my be off for sure. I am not very experienced testing my bodyfat, but I know I am not at the 10% level because I cannot see my abs. I would guess I am in the 14% area, but the calipers say otherwise. It's not much of a concern for me though, as long as I continue to improve my technique/strength/conditioning/flexibility and have a strong core, then seeing my abs is only a secondary goal.
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Old 06-05-2007, 02:54 PM   #5
Robb Wolf
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Mike-
The multiple training sessions can really buggar the feeding schedule. I think it's important to get some familiarity with how your body works on a more conventional eating schedule comprised of paleo foods. You can always shift more carbs to the post WO meal and make other meals more protein, greens and good fats. You will just have to tinker with that and dial things in to support your activity level. Once you are familiar with that then you can tinker with a compressed feeding schedule at some point.

We used a bit of IF with Glen Cordoza for inflammation management. He suffered a pretty good ankle tweak at one point and we fasted him till the next day and it was stunning how quickly he recovered. Black and blue one day, full mobility the following day and nearly 100% within a week. This is some of the advantage of very clean eating and a little smart intermittent fasting...tissue heals very quickly.

You really need to ease into this process however! We got Glen dialed into his paleo foods such that his body-weight was consistent and his recovery was good and then only a day or two here and there did we tinker with IF.
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Old 06-05-2007, 03:30 PM   #6
Mike Kirkpatrick
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robb Wolf View Post
Mike-
The multiple training sessions can really buggar the feeding schedule. I think it's important to get some familiarity with how your body works on a more conventional eating schedule comprised of paleo foods. You can always shift more carbs to the post WO meal and make other meals more protein, greens and good fats. You will just have to tinker with that and dial things in to support your activity level. Once you are familiar with that then you can tinker with a compressed feeding schedule at some point.

We used a bit of IF with Glen Cordoza for inflammation management. He suffered a pretty good ankle tweak at one point and we fasted him till the next day and it was stunning how quickly he recovered. Black and blue one day, full mobility the following day and nearly 100% within a week. This is some of the advantage of very clean eating and a little smart intermittent fasting...tissue heals very quickly.

You really need to ease into this process however! We got Glen dialed into his paleo foods such that his body-weight was consistent and his recovery was good and then only a day or two here and there did we tinker with IF.
Alright, so it sounds like IF is not ideal for me yet, so I'm going to give the paleo diet a try. What books would you recommend that cover paleolithic nutrition? I am going to get the Protein Power life plan, but I'm up for ordering any other books you recommend.
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Old 06-06-2007, 04:25 PM   #7
Robb Wolf
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Mike-
PPLP is pretty much the best thing going IMO. The paleo Diet is good but much less technical...worth a read for sure especially if you can track it down used.

Cordain has so many good articles on his site I'd certainly tear through that as well.
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Old 06-06-2007, 05:06 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robb Wolf View Post
Mike-
PPLP is pretty much the best thing going IMO. The paleo Diet is good but much less technical...worth a read for sure especially if you can track it down used.

Cordain has so many good articles on his site I'd certainly tear through that as well.
Interesting to mention both these authorities in the same context, particularly as they are good personal friends, because they have quite conflicting perspectives on the ideal amount of saturated fat to consume. Even more fascinating because they both use their respective interpretation of the available paleontological dietary evidence to support their almost diametrically opposed attitude to sat fat consumption . Personally my money's on the Drs Eades' attitude that restricting sat fat is a bad idea. As Mike says, if saturated fat were at all unhealthy, why did evolution specifically incorporate it as a major component of energy storage - and by extension, nutritonal suitability?

Stuart.
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Old 06-06-2007, 05:48 PM   #9
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I agree with Stuart.
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Old 06-07-2007, 09:49 AM   #10
Robb Wolf
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It is a REALLY interesting topic. Cordain makes the point that there would not have been much Sat. fat in the ancestral diet, at least as a % of calories.

Eades makes the point that so long as insulin levels are low sat fat poses no problem and actually has many benefits.

I think there is some truth to both points and am not super sure where I am on that topic.
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