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Old 10-12-2008, 09:06 PM   #1
Júlíus G. Magnússon
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Iceland
Posts: 555
Default Big Boy Muscle-up

Who here has a deadhang muscle-up?

I don't. But I really want one and I'd like to dedicate the next month or so to achieving one. (Long term goal being a deadhang muscle-up + 10kg, but that might take a year or two.)

I'm at a body weight of 70-75kg (my scale's been broken for months). My max number of consecutive kipping muscle-ups is four, and has been stuck at that number for pretty long now. The deadhang muscle-up still seems some way off.

What I'm currently doing is 3x5 weighted deadhang chin-ups (supinated grip, chest to bar) once a week. Up to bw+20kg, 3x5 or bw+21,25kg, 1x5, 2x4. A couple of days later, I've been weighted false-grip chin-ups in singles, doubles and triples (chest touches rings), up to a triple with 20kg.

I'm also considering adding some strict pull-up (chest to bar) to my routine, as well, making it look something like this:

Mon: Weighted deadhang chin-ups: 3x5 across
Thu: Bodyweight strict pull-up: 3x(Max reps)
Fri: Weighted false-grip ring chin-ups: 3-3-3-3-3 or 2-2-2-2-2 or 1-1-1-1-1

I'm not really worried about the dip portion of the muscle-up, I'm pretty sure I have that covered, so that probably doesn't need specific work.

How does this look? I'd like some input. If I should change something, add something, remove something, et cetera.

Note: I'm unable to work out on Wednesdays. All other days are free. Rest days usually being Wednesdays and Saturdays or just Wednesdays.

So yeah... bring on the comments/suggestions/flames/hatemail/threats.
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Old 10-12-2008, 11:23 PM   #2
Jeff Yan
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 88

Here are my ideas. I have no clue as to its efficacy as nobody I've suggested it to has actually bothered trying it.

idea #1
Lower your rings, and place a plyo box (or any stable elevated platform) in front of them. Set up the rings and box so that you can hang in your false grip and have your heels resting on the box in front of you. Do some muscle ups.

You should still be able to kip a bit by thrusting your hips up and forward, but the momentum will probably be muted compared to your regular kip. This will allow you to practice the pull up-to-dip transition phase, which of course is the trickiest part of the MU to train.

I would actually try this method out for someone who has never gotten a MU, as a way to introduce them to kipping. However, here I'm thinking that perhaps you can try to work backwards and use this as a way to wean yourself off the kip by gradually using less and less kipping force.

idea #2
Place the box slightly behind you and bend your knees so that the tips of your toes are resting on the box. Do some muscle ups.

This way, you won't be able to kip, but you'll still get some bodyweight relief assistance.

Please ask questions if this isn't clear, and let me know if this helps at all.
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Old 10-12-2008, 11:37 PM   #3
Derek Maffett
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 151

I did 100 muscle-ups in one set the other day. Would you believe it? One set.

Anyhow, I don't think you need all those pull-ups. Your problem is in the transition.

Box assists like Jeff mentioned are good as well as pretty much any other assist that lets you truly "muscle" the transition but with less resistance. Box is probably the easiest, but you could probably rig up something with bands or some such. Someone even made a complete pulley/harness system once (forget who).
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Old 10-13-2008, 12:07 AM   #4
Jeff Yan
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 88

Here's a video showing a progression:
courtesy of Leonid.

It also shows band-assisted MUs. The band setup seems fairly effective, but IMO it's a bit messy as you might need assistance to get in and out of it.

I think there might be a few more such videos showing the band setup.
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Old 10-13-2008, 12:13 AM   #5
Blair Lowe
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 593

Damn, that is insane, Derek. No idea you had gotten to that point.

I like both of Jeff's ideas but lately I have really digged the videos of L MU supported in a weight band more so. I used to do this way, but lately I've been doing a lot of them with my feet in a bike tube or calves on it.

Both of these are really good solutions for self-spotted muscle-ups. Very often, as a coach I would just go send the boys to do them on their own with a similar setup. There was just too many boys for me to dedicate time to spotting too many of them by myself. I didn't really like them doing jumping muscle-ups and having them spot each other didn't work out due to their little bickering or poor spotting each other ability. If I did it again, I would have had them do it in a band as I believe that's best.

Right now, I have just enough work capacity to do a few or half dozen after getting my shoulders loosened up for the pull and dip through the transition. More so, it's usually the dip transition that I'm weak on and have to use the self assist or spotting tools to get through it.
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Old 10-13-2008, 03:23 AM   #6
Derek Maffett
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 151

Did I just make an overly obscure joke again? I hope not...
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Old 10-13-2008, 07:03 AM   #7
Derek Simonds
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Deland, FL
Posts: 4,231

Originally Posted by Derek Maffett View Post
Did I just make an overly obscure joke again? I hope not...
I am going to say that you did. I have read and re-read trying to get your obscure joke but still can't. Inquiring minds want to know, please share.
What we think, or what we know, or what we believe, is in the end, of little consequence. The only thing of consequence is what we do. -John Ruskin

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Old 10-13-2008, 07:21 AM   #8
Steven Low
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,091

I want to see your current muscle up. Take a video and get it up and you will get the critique you need to make it. You pretty much easily have the strength to do it; mostly technique now.


And I think the joke was that Derek didn't actually do 100 MUs in one SET...?
Posts NOT intended as professional medical, training or nutrition advice.
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Old 10-13-2008, 07:53 AM   #9
Allen Yeh
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 4,245

This is a question that has been at the back of my mind back to early this year. This was one of my goals as well but the whole arm thing put it on the back burner. At the time I was having a very rough time even trying to hang completely dead hang with a false grip.

I was working the transition and the dip and the pullup with not much problem but a dead-hang false grip pullup seemed impossible at the time.
"And for crying out loud. Don't go into the pain cave. I can't stress this enough. Your Totem Animal won't be in there to help you. You'll be on your own. The Pain Cave is for cowards.
Pain is your companion, don't go hide from it."
-Kelly Starrett
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Old 10-13-2008, 08:21 AM   #10
Júlíus G. Magnússon
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Iceland
Posts: 555

Jeff Yan:
That makes a lot of sense. I don't have any bands but I will definitely be doing the box ones.

Derek Maffet:
I wouldn't even have believed you if you said you had gotten 100 pull-ups, much less muscle-ups. :P
It makes sense, though, to cut down on some of that volume so I don't feel too fatigued during the transition work.

Blair Lowe:
I'm pretty sure Derek was kidding about that. :P
I don't have any bands available, though... so I'll have to just go for the box thing Derek (the other Derek, that is) suggested.

Steven Low:
Do you want to see my kipping muscle-up or my deadhang muscle-up attempts?
I'll probably just take a video of both. Might be a couple of days, though, but it would be awesome to get some comments on my form from you.

I'll update this thread once I take the videos and if I make any progress.
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